The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Withdrawn. Giant Snowman 09:59, 18 July 2014 (UTC) reply

Middlesex Wanderers A.F.C.

Middlesex Wanderers A.F.C. (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)

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PROD contested by article creator who stated that "Middlesex Wanderers A.F.C. had long history and They visited asian country and affeted important influence." Being around for a long time and visiting a foreign country does not give you notability; significant coverage in reliable, third-party sources does per WP:GNG. This appears to be a non-notable amateur football team with little-to-no achievements. Giant Snowman 11:45, 9 July 2014 (UTC) reply

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Giant Snowman 11:45, 9 July 2014 (UTC) reply

*Delete - Fails WP:FOOTYN as has not played in a national competition. no indication of GNG. Fenix down ( talk) 15:14, 9 July 2014 (UTC) reply

Note: This debate has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 19:01, 9 July 2014 (UTC) reply

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 19:01, 9 July 2014 (UTC) reply

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Football-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 19:01, 9 July 2014 (UTC) reply

• Comment While there looks to be little or no possibility of their passing WP:NSPORT or related criteria, WP:GNG looks like a possibility, though far more in relation to the period before World War II than since - Google searches show at least passing mentions of them (usually just as Middlesex Wanderers) in football histories (and contemporary sources), along with Corinthian F.C., as touring internationally with top-class amateur players at a time when the costs and time involved for professional teams to do this would have been prohibitive. PWilkinson ( talk) 17:44, 13 July 2014 (UTC) reply
• Keep. While I agree there's nothing in the article currently to indicate the club's general notability, there's little doubt that they are notable. cheers, Struway2 ( talk) 13:21, 17 July 2014 (UTC) reply
  • Two books (at least) have been published about them, Bob Alaway's Football All Round The World (Newservice, 1948, 169pp) and Brian Wakefield's Centenary History (Replay, 2005, 190pp) (only £2 on a well-known bookselling site, I'm quite tempted)
  • This 2005 piece in the Telegraph gives a decent short overview
  • The club's constitutional remit is outlined here (scroll down past the details of what's being sold); it also says "The extent of the Club's reputation in the inter-war years is reflected in the fact that invitations were received from every part of Europe."
  • A biography of Walter Winterbottom mentions the influence of visits from British teams such as Middlesex Wanderers and Corinthians on the Austrian Hugo Meisl.
  • Pre-WW2, the national press frequently listed the members of their touring party ahead of their departures, said who they were playing, commented on the number of amateur internationals included, reported their matches
  • In 1926, 2LO radio broadcast a half-hour talk by Bob Alaway entitled "Football in Many Lands", a subject in which his role as Hon Sec of Middlesex Wanderers gave him some expertise.(Gloucester Citizen, "Broadcasting", 20 March 1926, p5)
  • In 1939, it became the first British team to play in Turkey;(The Times, "Middlesex Wanderers' Fiftieth Tour", 3 June 1939, p6) there's a montage of stills from their match against Fenerbahce as part of that club's jubilee celebrations on Youtube.
  • In 1949, they played the Dutch national XI at Feyenoord's ground in front of 35,000 spectators (lost 3–1).(The Times, "Association Football", 27 October 1949, p6)
  • In 1967, they played to huge crowds in Japan ( Charles Buchan's Football Monthly October 1967 says 46,000), paving the way for Arsenal's tour the following year, and the club was honoured by the Japanese government in 2003 for their "outstanding efforts to promote grassroots exchange between the UK and Japan" Embassy of Japan in UK, Telegraph.
  • In 1982, former FIFA president Sir Stanley Rous was appointed president of "the famous amateur touring club".(The Observer, no title, 3 March 1982, p20) Later presidents include Bobby Robson and Bobby Charlton.

@ Struway2: - great research, as ever, if you can expand the article I am more than happy to withdraw the AFD. @ Fenix down: do you care to re-think? Giant Snowman 17:35, 17 July 2014 (UTC) reply

It'd be a waste of time already spent if I didn't expand it, but please don't expect any more than what's above put into proper sentences. I'm still restoring stuff to a new laptop after the last one died while trying to catch up with real life after only 10 days at home in the last 5 weeks... cheers, Struway2 ( talk) 17:57, 17 July 2014 (UTC) reply

I agree and have struck my previous comment. To be honest, there is a fair bit in the links above that is bordering on routine for me, but the fact that there are two books on the club when it is just a touring team indicate that there is information out there. Fenix down ( talk) 08:53, 18 July 2014 (UTC) reply

• Keep Struway2 has clearly established notability above through significant coverage. Davewild ( talk) 07:51, 18 July 2014 (UTC) reply

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.