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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep.  Sandstein  14:03, 30 December 2015 (UTC) reply

Glen Carroll

Glen Carroll (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
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Lacks notabilty. Lacks coverage in independent reliable sources. No notability independent of his band. duffbeerforme ( talk) 10:57, 13 December 2015 (UTC) reply

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. sst✈ (discuss) 15:19, 13 December 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Delete - After 16 pages of Google search results, I could not find anything beyond a trivial interview. Notability is not inherited etc. Ceosad ( talk) 15:44, 13 December 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Delete simply instead of redirecting as there's unlikely anything for a better independent article. SwisterTwister talk 21:29, 13 December 2015 (UTC) reply
Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k ( talk) 00:35, 14 December 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep because the subject is widely discussed in Steven Kurutz's book (See the LA Times and NPR articles in the Ref list), and has media coverage for his song writing and performances, as well as an award. RS456 ( talk) 20:28, 17 December 2015 (UTC) — RS456 ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. reply
  • Keep This guy won the Billboard Songwriting Music Awards 2013,Also won the Akademia Music Award for Best Rock.He is the lead vocalist of the band (see) sticky fingers. Jaljogcyber ( talk) 12:26, 18 December 2015 (UTC) — Jaljogcyber ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. reply
  • Keep Notable i.a. as a symbol for the field of tribute singers, detained in the book "Like a rolling stone". The poor quality of the article shouldn't affect this, sometimes internet visibility can be deceptive. Doctorlaszlo ( talk) 19:24, 18 December 2015 (UTC) — Doctorlaszlo ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. reply
Not true, long-standing contributor to German Wikipedia [1] Doctorlaszlo ( talk) 13:56, 20 December 2015 (UTC) reply
Long-standing? Your first edit there was December 9, and you have 89 edits. Your edits to Fiverr show that you are aware of the problems with undisclosed WP:COI edits, so please don't take it personally if we are skeptical over a bunch of new accounts rushing in to save an obscure, recently created promotional article about a minor musician. Grayfell ( talk) 01:32, 21 December 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep Glen is Clearly notable and meets with all the guidelines of Encyclopedia, Sticky Fingers (tribute band) existing wikipedia page also brags about the notability. see published album on itunes [1] Charlie.rodricks ( talk) 07:02, 19 December 2015 (UTC) — Charlie.rodricks ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. reply
  • Delete and turn to a redirect to Sticky Fingers (tribute band). Although that article also has notability issues, the sources are almost entirely about the band, not specifically about this person. Having an album on iTunes and winning an award of questionable notability ( Akademia Music Award) do not demonstrate notability (see WP:ENT). The book is a lot closer, but it's still about the band, not the individual, and unless there are much better sources out there, this should covered there, not here. Grayfell ( talk) 10:39, 19 December 2015 (UTC) reply

References

  1. ^ Like a rolling stone
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — UY Scuti Talk 18:30, 20 December 2015 (UTC) reply

This perst....

  • Keep The subject is notable and contributors should improve the article for next level. This is my first entry in deletion discussion. I find the subject notable as it has it's appearance in Los Angeles Times and CBS News.Therefore the tone should be improved in order to make it non promotional and as per wikipedia guidelines. Kellyburstone ( talk) 15:47, 21 December 2015 (UTC) reply
The LA Times mention is in a review of a book, which is only partly about the band, of which Carroll is only one member. The book may be notable. The band may also, possibly, be notable, but how is Carroll notable? See WP:NOTINHERITED. Where is he mentioned by CBS News? Grayfell ( talk) 23:21, 21 December 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep per the significant coverage in reliable sources.
    1. du Lac, J. Freedom (2007-06-25). "Anyone Hear an Echo?; Fakefest, Where the Pretenders (Not the Real Ones) Come to Rock". The Washington Post. Retrieved 2015-12-28. (subscription required)

      The article notes:

      "I bring joy to people who otherwise couldn't afford to see the Stones," says Glen Carroll, the band's Mick Jagger doppelganger.

      ...

      Carroll is an interesting case study among rock-and-roll tribute actors. Never mind that he looks the part (right down the pouty lips and handsome wrinkles), or that he moves and sings like Jagger, nailing the singer's preeny poses and transatlantic bray. It's that he seems to be living somebody else's rock-and-roll lifestyle. He guzzles beer and smokes where no smoking is allowed and hits on just about every woman he encounters. He also talks himself up as a man of wealth and taste. Something about Sticky Fingers being paid as much as $10,000, though that kind of payday usually only comes overseas, Carroll says.

      "I have a house on the water in Florida," he says. "I have a Mercedes convertible that's paid for. I have a gold Presidential Rolex. I have women to die for from one end of the country to the next -- girls you just wouldn't believe." Later, he says: "It's sex, drugs and rock-and-roll." Is he joking? Acting for the sake of the notebook? Drunk?

      In his previous life, Carroll says, he was a military pilot. He's in his mid-40s now and says he's attending law school. But this rock- and-roll thing: He likes it. "I live for this," he says. "I do this because I see a beautiful woman smiling at me when I'm onstage, and it's . . . "

    2. Conan, Neal (2008-04-22). "'Like a Rolling Stone' an Ode to Tribute Bands". NPR. Archived from the original on 2015-12-28. Retrieved 2015-12-28.

      The article quotes from Steven Kurutz's book Like a Rolling Stone, which was published by Broadway Books according to this review in The New York Times and this review in Kirkus Reviews:

      When Glen Carroll travels for work, he takes a pair of black stage pants, a studded belt, and a few shirts, usually in splashy colors like bright red or banana yellow. If he wants to make a more noticeable impression, he might take something flashier, like a cape fashioned from an American flag and a British flag tied together, or a T-shirt imprinted with the Greek omega symbol and paired with a silk scarf, or white football pants with blue knee pads and Capezio dance shoes — an outfit very similar, as it happens, to the one Mick Jagger wore on the Rolling Stones' 1981 tour. For Glen, verisimilitude in dress is part of the job. As the singer of Sticky Fingers, which bills itself as "the leading international Rolling Stones tribute show," he is a kind of rock star proxy, a substitute Mick. And considering that the Rolling Stones tour only once every few years, and that Sticky Fingers has toured every year for the past eighteen years, it's likely that he has sung "Start Me Up," and "Brown Sugar," and "(I Can't Get No) Satisfaction" more times than Mick Jagger himself.

      Glen is slim and snake-hipped, with heavy-lidded eyes and a prominent, almost coltish mouth. At forty-seven, he resembles a slightly younger Mick Jagger — the Jagger of, say, Steel Wheels — and wears his brown hair in the same style: short in front, longer and feathery on the sides. Offstage, he favors blue jeans, a blazer, and scuffed loafers, or a T-shirt and motorcycle boots. At all times, he wears a gold Rolex "President" watch. In person, he has a sociable nature and a roguish charm and comes across like the kind of guy you might encounter late at night in a barroom, jive-talking one of the waitresses. As a bandleader, however, he is mercurial and governs by mood. He once threatened to fire the rhythm guitarist because his hair had grown beyond appropriate Ron Wood length. On the other hand, when he's having a good time, and particularly when he's been drinking, he will climb behind the drum kit, to the frustration of more authentic-minded band members. "Who ever heard of Mick Jagger playing the drums?" the drummer once remarked, exasperated. Glen is equally contradictory in appraising his own talents, swinging between modesty and extreme boastfulness. "I know what it's like to walk in Mick's shoes — with lift supports, mind you," he once told me. He has also told me, "If you want me to go out and front a band, I'll do it as good as maybe ten other guys in the world can do it."

      That a book provided significant biographical material about Glen Carroll strongly establishes that he is notable.
    There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Glen Carroll to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".

    Cunard ( talk) 03:19, 28 December 2015 (UTC) reply

  • Wikipedia:Notability (music)#Criteria for musicians and ensembles ( WP:MUSICBIO) says:

    Musicians or ensembles (this category includes bands, singers, rappers, orchestras, DJs, musical theatre groups, instrumentalists, etc.) may be notable if they meet at least one of the following criteria:

    1. Has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial, published works appearing in sources that are reliable, not self-published, and are independent of the musician or ensemble itself.

    This criterion includes published works in all forms, such as newspaper articles, books, magazine articles, online versions of print media, and television documentaries, [except for trivial coverage or non-independent material]

    Glen Carroll received significant coverage in The Washington Post. He received significant coverage in the Broadway Books–published book Like a Rolling Stone. He clearly passes WP:MUSICBIO. It does not matter whether the sources cover him in the context of the band he founded, Sticky Fingers (tribute band). It matters only that the sources cover him in substantial detail and are independent of him.

    There is enough material specifically about Glen Carroll in the reliable sources to justify a separate article about him.

    Cunard ( talk) 03:19, 28 December 2015 (UTC) reply

  • Glen Carroll contains plenty of reliably sourced material about the subject and the band. There is no reason to delete the article's history if it is redirected to Sticky Fingers (tribute band) because some of the material can be merged. Cunard ( talk) 03:27, 28 December 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep - His being the main focus of author Steven Kurutz's 220 page band biography [2] and inclusion in the additional references I just added [3] (there's more, I just didn't have time to get to them), the topic is WP:GNG qualified. -- Jreferee ( talk) 15:03, 29 December 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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