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Does anybody know his full name or even if that is his birth name? JoanB
His last name was Cook, like his father's, without the later added "e". I'm don't know of any middle name. Hammer 19:27, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)
German translation is complete, so leave a note at de:Diskussion:Sam Cooke if you change the English article. -- TomK32 14:31, 25 Sep 2003 (UTC)
There seem to be confusion about Cooke's date of birth. Various sources on the internet claim it's either 1930, 1931 or 1935. This website has a photo of Cooke's gravestone with the year 1930 on it. Thuresson 12:27, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
That stone appears to be some kind of commemorative stone with the wrong date, not a gravestone. Tcassedy 19:46, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
Why should it not be his gravestone? Is there any proof of that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Karbuncle ( talk • contribs) 17:26, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
I've edited at FindAGrave and the way they get most of their photos is by requesting a member who's near a particular cemetery to go there and take photos for anyone listed in that cemetery who doesn't already have one in their database. With that in mind, I would expect that this is a gravestone commemorating Mr. Cooke. The one trick is that supposedly he's in a "private area", but that might not keep a local person from seeking & obtaining permission to get such a photo. He might also have multiple stones (although perhaps not likely?) so we'd be depending on that person to choose an appropriate marker; we can, at least, see that they got one with the right name in the correct cemetery.
As far as his actual DOB, keep in mind also that he was born in rural Mississippi during the Depression era. This was likely a home birth, and it's also quite likely that time elapsed between the actual birth event and the filing of the application for a birth certificate, and a late December 1930 birth in a situation like this could give him a certificated birthday of January 22, 1931. While this is by no means certain, it's plausible and would explain the observed discrepancies. RenaissongsMan 02:47, 3 May 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Renaissongsman ( talk • contribs)
Anyone know when he was really active? I'm just going by the year he released his first single, and the year of his death.
Evan Reyes 22:23, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
This page says he graduated from high school in 1948. This isn't proof he was born in '30, but it may point in that direction. Most sources do state '31 however.-- 98.216.10.207 ( talk) 19:58, 2 December 2009 (UTC) http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/notorious_murders/celebrity/sam_cooke/5.html
His death certificate states that he was born in 1932 http://findadeath.com/Deceased/c/Sam%20Cooke/dc.jpg and so does even California Death Index 1940-1997 according to Ancestry.com. However Social Security Death Index states that he was born in 1931. I don't know which one that is the most trusted of those two. Also, California Death Index and Social Security Death Index gives different social security numbers for him. Karbuncle ( talk) 15:47, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
There are no reference footnotes. Part of the article seems to be quoting someone's point of view. Whose material is this? Editors of this article need to read WP:V and WP:CITE. Thanks! Mattisse (talk) 22:26, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
The starting point for any serious discussion and examination of Sam Cooke's life and art is Peter Guralnick, Dream Boogie: The Triumph of Sam Cooke(New York: Little, Brown, 2005), which is cited in the wiki entry on Cooke, and in the bibliography. Guralnick devotes an entire chapter, plus an "Aftermath," to the circumstances surrounding Cooke's death (pp. 609-651; footnotes, 701-05). His scholarship is lucid, precise, and thorough--a magisterial account, by a renowned critic and musicologist. Do not engage in idle speculation. Instead, read the literature, read it carefully, and avoid engaging in pointless controversy about matters that have long since been settled. If you disagree with Guralnick, or wish to raise issues that are independent of those in his book, fine. Just make sure that your comments are relevant, well-supported, and devoid of mere conjecture, be it about Sam Cooke or anything else. Otherwise, you will either reinvent the wheel, perpetuate false and discarded claims, or undermine and erode the standards of rational discourse. Sufficient unto the day is the sheer nonsense thereof.
The article devotes many more words about Cooke's death than it does about his life and accomplishments. That seems very odd and imbalanced -- his life was certainly more notable than the circumstances of his death. Shouldn't the bio section be expanded, and/or the "death" controvery be reduced down to a paragraph or two? Vandelay 13:21, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
What we don't need is a reference to his penis. If he had no underwear or pants his penis would be exposed. The reference is therefore unnecessary, and could be read as implying an erect penis. 124.197.15.138 ( talk) 06:53, 13 November 2009 (UTC)
The circumstances of his death are fairly clear. There are conspiracy theories. These should however be in a separate section, as they are pretty clearly speculation and inconsistent with known facts or the likely events. 203.184.41.226 ( talk) 07:54, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
Sam was a great talent...truly sad that his life was cut so short. I agree that the women involved in his killing definitely sound extremely shady. To me, it's obvious that he was at least robbed by the dumb hooker. Not sure it involved an actual murder conspiracy or not...probably will never know.Tom 70.119.219.0 16:09, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
http://www.morticom.com/famousdeathsmusiciansphoto004.jpg http://www.morticom.com/famousdeathsmusiciansphoto004b.jpg JSDA ( talk) 22:45, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
I think You Send Me is going to be in the public domain in the UK in october. Shame we can't add it to wikipedia, as US copyright law is 95 years + 70, instead of 50. Supposed 03:59, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
It says that Sam had managed to publish a record post-mortem, entitled "Shake." Had he already recorded this and it had not been finished ny the time he died in '64? ~white.matthew.09 (forgot to sign in) 209.137.182.35 10:35, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:Footnotes for an explanation of how to generate footnotes using the <ref(erences/)> tags Nhl4hamilton ( talk) 04:28, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
Just wondered whether anybody agreed with me in that the lead might contain peacock terms, in that statements such as 'his impact on soul music is undeniable' shouldn't be used, especially in the lead. I'm not saying he wasn't great, just that in keeping with the theme of an encyclopedia, you should show that he's a legend by saying what he's achieved, without saying directly that he was great. Ru dy 16:46, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I'm not sure if the POV issue that has been raised here before is still an issue, but when I first saw the article, quite a bit of it seemed biased IMHO. As groovy as Sam is, I don't think it needs to be mentioned in every other sentence. I also understand that his death is pretty controversial, but it needs to be presented in a neutral and encyclopedic manner. That being said, I made some bold edits and reworded/reworked some of the article. I also replaced the references used, more specifically, the ourunclesam.com refs. I have no idea who added them, but they didn't indicate where the information was located in the book (ie page numbers) if that's what the references were suppose to represent. There's still quite a bit that needs to be done on the article, mainly additional references and more on Cooke's life, so if anyone has a problem-o about my edits, let me know. Pinkadelica 07:19, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
I'm a little puzzled as to why the period Sam Cooke spent singing Gospel, prior to his pop success, isn't mentioned at all?-- ReTracer ( talk) 08:01, 12 April 2009 (UTC)
I have just begun looking for "free images" for musicians' pages that have had to rely entirely on " fair use" photos in the past month or two. I've been uploading photographs for musicians' biography articles for the past few years --my area of interest on the en.Wikipedia, es.Wikipedia, pt.Wikipedia, etc. (as well as editing articles, of course), however, until two months ago it had not occured to me to look for free photos in addition to my normal reasons (updating photos, replacing bad ones, adding additional ones for musicians with long careers, as with Mick Taylor, and providing photos for articles who had no photo at all). Having some success with a handful of artists, ( John Paul Jones, John Bonham, etc.) I hope to find one of Cooke, since he died in the 1960s, though I admit it is a long shot. While "nesting" several groups interested in an artist is good, can someone remind me how to place a "request photograph" template below the nested group, so it is visable immediately without need for clicking the various groups? It is not just for this article but for other pages missing photos altogether. I have forgotten it, outside of the biography listas parameter. Oh, and if anyone would like me to search for free images for any musicians (and some other photographs, as well), please leave a note for both things on my talk page. I could not possibly keep all these talk pages on my watch list! Thank you.-- Leahtwosaints ( talk) 14:49, 31 January 2010 (UTC)
It's important because given the climate of the mid 1960's, many people assume he was shot by a white woman and subsequently blamed for his own death because he was black and she white - a very common occurrence before the civil rights movement.
It's amazing that I held this assumption myself for decades, even discussing this matter with several other people who were also misinformed. We remarked on the travesty that the man who sang an anthem for the Civil Rights movement was gunned down in what was likely a racially-motivated homicide.
I finally stumbled on the fact that he was shot by an African-American and quickly checked the Wikipedia article. I was stunned to find that it was missing this crucial and relevant information. One can speculate on the reasons why it wasn't included before I added it (with citation) and why it was removed within hours after I added it. However, a desire to perpetuate the misconception of a racially motivated killing while hiding the irony that the man who sang one of the most important songs of the Civil Rights movement was gunned down by one of his own certainly comes to mind.
Wikipedia is all about access to correct information. Deletion of a properly cited edit on the basis that you do not want readers to know that fact are not in the spirit of Wikipedia. If you believe it is irrelevant, please discuss it here and the results of this discussion can steer the content of the article without unilateral deletion of content. In the mean time, I will revert its deletion.-- Bodybagger ( talk) 05:00, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
About seventy per cent of all prisoners in the South are black; this, however, is in part explained by the fact that accused Negroes are still easily convicted and get long sentences, while whites still continue to escape the penalty of many crimes even among themselves.
This entire argument is absurd. Bodybagger, your argument is confusing and some of your statements are just plain off-putting (I hope you can appreciate the irony of threatening to revert anyone who edits unilaterally). I will address your points one-by-one:
No one is questioning the veracity of the information, but rather its importance. I don't think it's relevant in any way, shape, or form. Neither does Pinkadelica. Neither, evidently, have the thousands of people who have viewed and/or edited this article over the years, since it has never been inserted before (to the best of my knowledge). faithless (speak) 01:15, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
I'll just weigh in to vote that I personally think it's relevant, if only as a question that people would like to have answered, and I'd rather see Wikipedia err on the side of giving information rather than withholding it. The race of the shooter means everything to how such an event from 1964 is going to be interpreted. Also, I have personally run across theories online that Cooke's death was racially motivated, along with a great deal of other misinformation. Although I can't document unreliable conspiracy theories in print, as would seem to be the demand here, a vote to suppress information about the shooter would seem to me to be a vote to keep this question alive rather than simply answer it. Just one person's opinion, respectfully submitted.
John Lennon and his killer are not really a good comparison, because Lennon was not closely identified with the Civil Rights movement, as Cooke is due to his classic song "A Change Is Gonna Come".
Perhaps the answer is simply to include news pictures of the two women involved in Cooke's death. They're out there. Also, perhaps Cooke's death was enough of an event to rate a main article, which could then be more expansive in nature.
Lastly, regardless of the legal parsing of murder, libel, homicide, etc., I also think it's somewhat misleading and unfair to refer to someone who shoots in self-defense a man who broke down a door to get to her and assaulted her several times, and was then cleared of wrongdoing, as a murderer. That carries a much different shade of meaning for most people, myself included, regardless of what the law books say. "Shooter" seems like the more appropriate term to me. But it's only a talk page. Joe Suggs ( talk) 05:59, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
I believe this discussion got off to a wrong start. The "edit wars" were bad, and as Joe Suggs stated, Franklin should not be described as a "murderer." At the same time, I fail to see what it would hurt to describe Franklin as a "55 year old African American" in that section. This is a fact and would give readers a more accurate picture of who Cooke allegedly struggled with that night. She was old and heavyset, while Cooke was a man and much younger. Are there any sources saying this is not notable? I didn't see the original edits made, but perhaps they were in poor taste. Gunned down by one of his own surely is an unnecessary thing to say. The race and age are minor factual details that arguably do not hurt the article. Any thoughts? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.216.14.212 ( talk) 04:41, 8 December 2010 (UTC)
If 80% of the people of the United States were "white" in 1964 it would have been logical to assume that the woman was white. If a person was not identified as being "Negro" or "colored" the assumption was that the person was white. It has been 53 years since Cooke was killed and until I read these comments today I had always assumed that the woman was "white." Much respect to all who do their best to maintain complete objectivity in all Wikipedia entries. 66.162.249.170 ( talk) 02:07, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
given wiki's aspirations of neutrality, why is he listed as a murdered entertainer? who murdered him? his killer was ruled to have committed a justified homicide. very very sloppy and slanderous. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.253.24.229 ( talk) 06:34, 28 May 2010 (UTC)
Pinkadelica, your definition of "murder" is not accurate in legal nor lay terms. See the wiki entry on the subject. Your statements on slander are also questionable. However, I agree that using the term "slander" in this situation is not accurate. Saying that Cooke was murdered is POV. Some people believe he was murdered and there is a chance he was, but this is not established fact. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.216.14.212 ( talk) 03:28, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
This is an old section. See below for changes about "murder" that I've made to this article.
Tapered (
talk) 03:45, 8 October 2014 (UTC)
He is simply American. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.59.126.203 ( talk) 08:44, 26 June 2011 (UTC)
Barbara Cooke is given short thrift in this article ... it seems she was very young when she married Sam Cooke ... maybe about 19 or so ... also read Midnight Mover by Bobby Womack, Robert Ashton
--- — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.8.24.67 ( talk) 07:34, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
hello,
according to the Jet magazine, Sam Cooke died exactly the same date Otis Redding did, namely on December 10, see [2], page 60. So, where is the source stating he died a day later? This should be resolved. Regards.-- ♫GoP♫ T C N 12:13, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
Additional sources also support December 11 as being Cooke's DOD:
All those sources, coupled with Cooke's death certificate lead me to believe the original date of death that was listed in the article, December 11, 1964, was indeed correct. I think the content should be changed back. Pinkadelica ♣ 22:56, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
One of the few "facts" that would suggest that Sam Cooke's death was not as simple as it appears is Etta James' claim that Cooke had been badly beaten, in particular that he had been almost decapitated, and that his nose had been smashed. I am not sure how much damage Mrs Franklin's broom could cause. But doesn't the autopsy report lay resolve this matter? The police scene photos do not show a body with a smashed nose, and there appears no neck wound. Was Etta in town then, and if she had been would a young woman like her have been allowed into a morgue? 203.184.41.226 ( talk) 08:34, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
Article current has the text
Posthumously releases of Cooke recordings followed, many of which became hits, including " A Change Is Gonna Come", an early protest song that is generally regarded as his greatest composition. [1]
This should probably be rewritten. A Change is Gonna Come was on Ain't_That_Good_News_(album), so was not released posthumusly, although the single did come out after his death. I tried my hand, but nothing I wrote sounded right. Gaijin42 ( talk) 16:38, 3 February 2014 (UTC)
References
I've eliminated Same Cooke fr/ four Wikipedia Category lists in which he doesn't belong: 1964 crimes in the United States, Murdered entertainers, American murder victims, and People murdered in California.
His death, as per the well-referenced article, was legally declared a justifiable homicide, which is not a crime--ergo no "crime" category. Since it was ruled a justifiable homicide, it can't be a Murder, by Wikipedia's definition, or any other. So Same Cooke doesn't fit into any "murder" category.
This will make some readers and editors very unhappy, but the logic is sound and consistent with Wikipedia's Neutral point of view. I'm going to watch the article. Regards Tapered ( talk) 04:03, 8 October 2014 (UTC)
Just one problem with your theory concerning the use of the "at that time," being incorrect. You falsely assume that the case has been legally opened and examined by authorities since his death. It has not been opened or reinvestigated, therefore your premise that the new investigation would not bring up new information is false. What we do know is that the woman he was with was later arrested for prostitution and connected to the death of her boyfriend; therefore it is not unreasonable to think that this case should be reopened and that a different opinion might be reached. At that time, with what they new of the woman with an alleged clean background, that was the decision they made, at that time. At this time, we know the woman was not so innocent. You also falsely claim that this is a groundswell of concern coming only from people who knew him. As we saw with the Natalie Woods case, there was enough cause to reopen the case, new information was entered into the case, the coroner's office added new information to her file, and the groundswell came from much of the world as the case was obviously problematic to so many. It is hypocritical for you to speak of Wiki requiring a neutral point of view, when your points are very biased and illinformed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:147:C002:D83A:C85F:A801:69D:CA2A ( talk) 05:45, 22 May 2017 (UTC)
One of his infant children drowned in a swimming pool while he was still alive. Lends perspective to some of his later behavior. "In 1963, Cooke's infant son Vincent--one of his three children--drowned in the family pool." [1] I would like this to be added to his "Personal Life."
@ 70.127.53.76: I reverted your latest two edits, which changed this sentence in the lead paragraph:
Since that time, the circumstances of his death have been called into question by Cooke's family and his wide circle of friends and acquaintances.
to the following:
As is the usual case concerning the deaths of famous people before middle age, the circumstances of his death have been called into question by Cooke's family and his wide circle of friends and acquaintances.
As I see it, these edits put your personal opinion into the article, which is contrary to Wikipedia's WP:NPOV policy.
On the merits, I don't think there was the same level of debate about the possibility of other celebrities who died young, such as Jimi Hendrix and John Belushi, having been murdered as there was about whether Sam Cooke was murdered. Strawberry4Ever ( talk) 00:51, 3 January 2016 (UTC)
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Citations 43 and 44 are dead links, making the statement about Boyer's story long being questioned unsourced. The original source sounds untrustworthy to me, since websites of that kind are generally synopses of famous and/or unusual deaths, and give little real information. KimbaBrown ( talk) 22:31, 9 September 2016 (UTC)
Etta James had a long and distinguished career in music, but as far as I know, she never obtained a medical degree. Why is her statement about the body's physical condition in an encyclopedia entry? It says she viewed the body before the funeral. I'm assuming this was a family and close friends viewing which is fairly typical, and not that she got to see anything that several dozen, perhaps hundreds, of other people didn't. If there were any unusual injuries, they could have been perpetrated by the medical personnel who removed the body, the coroner and/or the mortician and associated personnel. I think the James citation should be entirely removed. Can anyone tell me why it shouldn't be? Unless it's there just to illustrate the mindset of his family and friends, and the belief they have of a coverup? In which case it should be noted as such. There probably should be a separate conspiracy section KimbaBrown ( talk) 22:44, 9 September 2016 (UTC)
Does anyone else think the quotes from AllMusic in the lead section are peacock language? Could they be replaced, please? Tapered ( talk) 04:37, 10 April 2018 (UTC)
The article used to say: "...Boyer was arrested for prostitution in January 1965, though the charge was dismissed and she accrued no more notoriety." I just edited out the words "and she accrued no more notoriety" in light of articles which say that she had multiple subsequent prostitution arrests, and a second degree murder conviction in 1979. I'm not including them in the article at this stage, because they aren't from well known sites with an established record of fact checking, and they give no sourcing for the assertion. This for example: http://weeklyview.net/2014/12/18/the-death-of-sam-cooke-part-2/ I'm checking books on the subject for anything more definitive, but for now, thought that those six words (which aren't really reflected in the cited reference anyway) should probably go. 136.0.16.230 ( talk) 22:27, 2 March 2019 (UTC)
@ Aikclaes: Regarding the phrase "civil rights:" I am not familiar with the Wikipedia guidelines you mention. I am however 69 years of age, and considered somewhat well read and up to date on news events. I have seen "civil rights" thousands of times in the course of my reading, and it's never been hyphenated that I can recall. I suggest reading the following articles: Murders of Chaney, Goodman, and Schwerner, Martin Luther King Jr., and (best of all) Civil rights movement. You could ?remedy? these articles by 'hyphenating' them, and then finding all the other (likely hundreds) of repititions of this 'error' found throughout Wikipedia. Or you could revert the hyphen from this article about a great singer—in accordance with comman usage. Or you could find some third option similar to and just as stupid as the first option. Tapered ( talk) 07:39, 9 June 2019 (UTC)
Sam Cooke was a hugely influential and popular figure in music. Yet this article has more text, now, about his death than about his career. Would it be better, given the amount of detail that some editors want to include, to have a new article, Death of Sam Cooke, as we have Death of Marvin Gaye? Ghmyrtle ( talk) 18:19, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
The "Weekly Review" used to substantiate info about Franklin & Boyer doesnt meet the requirements for WP:RS. The claim about Boyer being jailed has been around for a long time, but this editor has never seen corroboration from a reliable source. Tapered ( talk) 04:06, 18 March 2021 (UTC)
Yea I love your songs I wish you be alive again but a simple things has gone bad 0-0 2601:3C7:4281:8420:95C2:A532:E73B:47F0 ( talk) 02:30, 5 December 2021 (UTC)
"She said she ran first to the manager's office and knocked on the door seeking help." As currently written, "she" refers to Bertha Franklin, who is the subject of the previous paragraph. But the actions described don't make sense unless Boyer is the one who did them. Would someone who knows the answer please clarify this passage? Thanks. Hebeckwith ( talk) 02:04, 28 August 2022 (UTC)