This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Dragon Skin article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2 |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article may be too technical for most readers to understand.(September 2010) |
I propose merging Pinnacle Armor into [[Dragon Skin]. Pinnacle Armor is a stub about the defunct company that produced Dragon Armor. I have already added the content from that page into the Dragon Skin page as a section. A merger would not cause any article-size or weighting problems in Dragon Skinm. Pizzarush ( talk) 05:51, 3 June 2022 (UTC)
nothing said on Future Weapons should be taken as fact EVER; it is an infomercial and nothing more. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.225.145.129 ( talk) 04:06, 29 December 2010 (UTC)
That was shown on Future weapons, which is as reliable as a study about climate change made by Haliburton, so that "test" that demonstrated that capability should not be stated as a fact or at least have the fact that Future Weapons is not the slightest bit reliable noted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.231.212.171 ( talk) 04:34, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
Where is the source of the statement, "Currently, Dragon Skin is being worn by some civilian contractors in Iraq, some elite special forces in Iraq and Afghanistan, some SWAT teams, 9 generals in Afghanistan and Iraq". Where is the source, Pinnacle? If true, Generals wearing Body Armor that their troops can't get is disgraceful! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Onguo2 ( talk • contribs) 05:43, 30 May 2007
It's just an article about body armor. Whether the Wikipedia article puts it in a positive, negative, or neutral POV will not have any effect outside of Wikipedia and those who read it. So, the hostility and tempers are really pointless (and why would you feel so strongly about it unless you were part of Pinnacle, one of its competitors, or a potential user; all of which would disqualify you from being objective). If you feel strongly on this issue, I'd advise you to stick to posting verifiable facts, not claims, conclusions, or opinions. Be civil. Thanks! Bahamut0013 12:40, 14 August 2007 (UTC)
Being a potential user would in no way 'disqualify you from being objective'. I use oxygen daily, but am fairly comfortable with my ability to discuss it objectively. 74.101.174.18 01:28, 13 September 2007 (UTC)
I find it sad that the army puts saving money over saving lives —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.83.82.102 ( talk) 01:00, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
Aside from the general POV / COI issues which are abundantly clear just from looking at the page, the lack of an image or two is a glaring omission. Are there any appropriately-licensed images which could be added? Chris Cunningham 15:05, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
a "Level V" variant, which does not correspond to any body armor standard
This statement in the article is not true. The mere existance of Level V has been officially announced, it protects against the latest development in armour-piercing ammunitions, including tests for multi-shot protection (Level IV had single shot stopping requirement only). The exact caliber and muzzle speed of AP bullets used in Level V certification remains a military state secret of the USA, however, because the big brass do not want give free hints to the jihadists on what rifle to buy to defeat Level V body armour. 82.131.210.162 ( talk) 16:41, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
Level IV is in the latest NIJ standard; "Level V" is not. Level IV is roughly equivalent to US DoD ESAPI plates, so it is assumed that "Level V" would be equivalent to XSAPI plates, whcih have a classified protection level. NATO protection levels are also classified and are not available to the general public. There ARE secret bullets. Tell me what the M993 is and then I'll report you to the DoD. Secret does not mean imaginary. Armor is tested against existing, Classified and Unclassified threats. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.163.90.2 ( talk) 22:41, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
"vest stopped all the bullets fired during a test" and lines like this, are all over the article, suggesting the tests STOP the bullets and ignore the actual impact damage. Do any of the documents talk about the impact and damage caused BEHIND the armour? Simply stopping a bullet isn't nearly good enough, as while you might stop the bullet you can still kill the wearer with the blunt force through the armour itself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Talroth ( talk • contribs) 23:02, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
Says you. ::chukles:: I know of about 4 that you have no clue of. USAF SGT. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.148.72.40 ( talk) 09:58, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Under "History Channel and Discovery Channel tests" there is a reference to "pointed steel ammunition." This seems ambiguous. Are the bullets in question steel-jacketed? Did they have a steel penetrator? The phrase "pointed steel ammunition" makes it sound like solid steel projectiles with a sharp point in front, which I seriously doubt is what was meant. 0x539 ( talk) 19:31, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
Most of this article reads like an advertisement for Dragon Skin. dougmc ( talk) 12:03, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
Thats because it is so good all you can do is advertise it!!!!1 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.136.110.99 ( talk) 22:36, 2 September 2009 (UTC)
the armor that is twice the weight of interceptor and failed all tests is that good? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.225.145.129 ( talk) 21:18, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
one thing that u r wrong on is that there is testing with secret ammuntions that only the millitary conduct against ammor not just body but tanks and thus forth i live near a testing place for the millitary and they test everything even bullets well more like projectiles that we probly wont seen untill were all old and senile and some kid in like 2050 would be reading this laughing. the millitary base i live close to is in tn and they mostly test top secret millitary project for aero space and flight but they do an test on ballestics too its call AEDC. well any who theres ur bit of info for the day and no i cannot tell u wat there are test cus its all hush hush all i know is that they to the testing there. and for most of the nut jobs that read this yes i may have miss spelled somthings on here but owell i have better things to do with my time besides try to tell someone how to spell. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.166.204.32 ( talk) 11:35, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
What the hell did you just say? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.230.191.51 ( talk) 01:03, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
He said "I am an idiot pulling nonsense out of my butt." —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
144.226.230.36 (
talk) 05:35, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
Hold on hold on, I took mentally challenged speak as an elective for four years, I think I can communicate with him. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
76.184.221.210 (
talk) 20:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)
I know this might be a wee bit off topic however, despite the bullet not penetrating the ceramic plate; Has it been tested on a simulated human body? I'm thinking that the bullet when it hits, would feel like somebody just poked you incredibly hard, and possibly deal more 'concussive' damage then when your hit with Interceptor on you. Thoughts? If it proves true It would be a good thing to add to the topic. -- 66.37.173.201 ( talk) 18:42, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
I Beleve it was tested on a silicone stand-in with actual bone structure. They do that these days you know. Now I don't know about the results because I wasn't high enough rank to know I guess. And as for the actual kineticforce. The amount of inward travel do to Kenetic force is 2in into the cavity, where as the lethal inward travel for a protective vest is 4in into the cavity. Meaning that it actually reaches internal organs and can cause catastrofic failure. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.148.72.40 ( talk) 10:14, 25 February 2012 (UTC)
Jathtech ( talk) 22:17, 2 December 2009 (UTC): I was the original writer of this section, and I tried to be as neutral as possible when I wrote it. I seem to have failed in that. the section had been deleted several times before the current iteration had been written. I appreciate whoever has adjusted it to its current state, because it says everything that I was trying to say, minus the bias. Good jobs, and thanks for not simply deleting it again.
Is there any proof as to the claim (not in the wiki-article) that those with power to "fail or pass" the dragonskin actually owned (stock) a part of the company that makes the current issue Interceptor vests? That would make for a nice little lawsuit.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.179.12.93 ( talk) 23:08, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
Karl Masters was quoated as writing:
"I was recently tasked by the army to conduct the test of the 30 Dragon Skin SOV-3000 level IV body armor purchased for T&E [tests and evaluation]," Masters wrote. "My day job is acting product manager for Interceptor Body Armor. I'm under a gag order until the test results make it up the chain. I will, however, offer an enlightened and informed recommendation to anyone considering purchasing an SOV-3000 Dragon Skin—don't. I do not recommend this design for use in an AOR with a 7.62x54R AP threat and an ambient temperature that could range to 120 F. I do, however, highly recommend this system for use by insurgents..."
I would hope that someone who works in the armour industry is awair that a level IV vest is not intended to stop armour peircing full power rifle cartriges (7.62x54R AP)... The ability to do so is what qualifies as the minimum entry into level V so he is denouncing the vests quality for something it is not intended to do anyway. Perhaps a note should be made on page identifying him as a hostile source having a vested interest in the Interceptor system?
sorry, no account on this wiki. - anon — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.64.42.39 ( talk) 20:29, 20 July 2011 (UTC)
Heck, spelling armor with a "u" is evidence that you don't likely work in the *US* armor industry. More to the point, 7.62x54R AP has similar penetrating power to 0.30cal APM2 (7.62x63, hard steel core) which is the standard Level IV threat.
NIJ Level IV armor will stop a 0.30 caliber (7.62x63) APM2 bullet. I know this because I've read NIJ Standard 0101.06 "Ballistic Resistance of Body Amor" plenty of times.
Also, the US Military issues two types of plate to its troops with the Interceptor system: ESAPI and XSAPI. XSAPI's protection level is classified, but ESAPI protects against 0.30cal APM2 as well. I know that because I've read the Purchase Description for ESAPI plates, and because the ESAPI plates in my office have "7.62 mm APM2 Protection" printed right on them.
In other words, Interceptor DOES protect against 7.62x54R AP in the areas where there are hard plates, so should any competing military armor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.163.90.2 ( talk) 21:43, 27 September 2012 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Dragon Skin. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{
Sourcecheck}}
).
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 17:36, 16 December 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 3 external links on Dragon Skin. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
{{
dead link}}
tag to
http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/news/nation/14358966.htmWhen you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 20:40, 13 September 2017 (UTC)