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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Camilo Cienfuegos article. This is
not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
A fact from Camilo Cienfuegos appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the Did you know column on 7 April 2024 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
Did you know... that after his movement's victory in the
Cuban Revolution, television broadcasts showed Camilo Cienfuegos(pictured) freeing parrots from birdcages, declaring that the birds had "a right to liberty"?
In the article is said, that Cienfuegos' family fled Spain because of the Civil War. That war started in 1936. Does someone know how Cienfuegos, who was born in 1932, could be born in Havana, four years before the war? Was it maybe a foster family? —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
93.135.70.247 (
talk) 08:39, 5 March 2011 (UTC)reply
The family left Spain before the civil war. Camilo was born in Lawton La Habana in 1932 and his parents were his natural parents. Clearly there's a mistake as to when exactly his parents left Spain.
Mickavellian (
talk) 01:18, 17 July 2013 (UTC)reply
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Passed. The
Blue Rider 02:14, 21 March 2024 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the
Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed
Hello! Good to see a
WP:VA biography being brought to GA status. I will try to post my first review until the end of this week. Thank you! The
Blue Rider 19:38, 5 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Thanks very much for taking this one! This is my fourth vital GA nomination. I'll be away over the weekend, so I'll probably get around to addressing your comments some time next week. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 10:12, 6 March 2024 (UTC)reply
@
The Blue Rider: Thanks for the review. I'm going to need a few more days to get around to addressing your comments, as I've come down with something during my time away. Once I've recovered, I'll get right to it. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 15:11, 12 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Lead
"in some cases even being considered second only to Fidel himself" contradicts him being "widely considered second only to Fidel Castro".
Removed "widely" to be safe. To be clear, the source in this case says he "bid fair to become almost as popular as Castro himself and was "the man best loved in Cuba after Castro". Let me know if you think this can be improved further. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:21, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Per
MOS:LEADLENGTH, it is reccomended that leads have 3 or 4 paragraphs, so I would suggest merging the first paragraph with the second.
I've merged some of the paragraphs, it's down to four now. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:21, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Source doesn't say. I would have to look into this. He was already active in the anti-Batista movement, so I can only assume that was one of his main motives. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:24, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Substitute Sierra Maestra with region, in "over the region" and then start the next sentence with region.
Good catch, done. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:36, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
The armed groups are the revolutinaries, the national army or both? I also take issue with how the word anarchy is being used, I understand that its popular meaning is being used here but maybe substitute it with chaos.
Some revolutionaries, but also some unaffiliated outlaw bands. I've rewritten the sentence, let me know what you think. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:36, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
This doesn't appear to be the same person. Juan Pablo Chang Navarro was killed in Bolivia in 1967, where this "Chino Chang" was executed in Cuba in 1957. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:36, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Ops! I guess there are two Chino Chang involved in guerrilas. The
Blue Rider 12:54, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Do you think that Camp Columbia (Havana) merits a redlink?
Added. Thankfully this note made me realised I had unconsciously hispanisied the name to "Colombia", but all the sources use the spelling "Columbia" because the base was originally established by the Americans during the first occupation of Cuba. Glad I caught this. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:53, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Why were the officers worried by the Castro's regime?
"Castro's consolidation of power, as well as the increasing role of the Popular Socialist Party in government, began to worry some officers in the Revolutionary Army" Is this not clear enough? I thought it was pretty obvious. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 13:00, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
I don't know why I missed that, but yes, it's pretty obvious. The
Blue Rider 13:11, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Was Cienfuegos gay/bisexual? If so, clarify that since two quotes describe him as gay and other as having a love of women.
Oh no, this was at a time before "gay" had the connotations of sexuality. I'm 90% sure they're using the original definition of "happy"/"carefree". --
Grnrchst (
talk) 13:05, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
This sections relies too much on quotations, try to rephrase it.
I've been looking at this section for a few days now and I'm still struggling with how I could rephrase it. These are all such subjective views of his personality that I'm not sure how I could possibly neutralise them into wikivoice. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:24, 17 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Political ideology
All good here.
Leadership style
This section relies too much on quotations, try to rephrase them.
The quotations here and in the personality section were two places where I felt it very difficult to put it into wikivoice, because these reflections almost always come from personal perspectives. I can give it a go, but I already struggled with it in the first place. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 16:47, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Maybe try to say, "According to X Cienfuegas was Y or X described Cienfuegos has Y. If that doesn't work then it's fine. The
Blue Rider 18:08, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Ok, I've managed to rewrite the quotes in the leadership style section. I'll have to think further about the personality section though, as I'm not sure how possible it is. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 09:42, 15 March 2024 (UTC)reply
This section seems to be lacking for a highly popular figure, isn't there more pop culture depictions of him?
If I'd come across more, I would have added more. Tried searching around just now but couldn't find anything else. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 16:46, 14 March 2024 (UTC)reply
Image(s)
All images are correctly tagged and have suitable captions, pass!
Stability
Some reverts here and there but overall stable, pass!
Sources
All source numbers are from
this version. Checked sources 1, 2, 3, 9, 21, 23, 41, 48, 58, 103, 117, 118, 191 and 233.
Source 1 is no longer available.
Source 9, especifically Quirk, says some run away to the mountains and other to the south, the text only has the former.
Copyvio
Earwig's Copyvio Detector points to
10,7% due to some partially copied sentences, I suggest them to be rephrased.
Not sure where the 10.7% figure came from, Earwig never showed that for me. It only highlighted a wee bit in the legacy section for me, so I cut it down a bit. --
Grnrchst (
talk) 12:25, 17 March 2024 (UTC)reply
No, everything is in order! Good job on the article. You are missed at WP:VA! The
Blue Rider 02:13, 21 March 2024 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Did you know nomination
The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as
this nomination's talk page,
the article's talk page or
Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
ALT9: ... that on the anniversary of the disappearance of Camilo Cienfuegos(pictured), schoolchildren throw flowers into the seas and rivers of Cuba? Source: Casuso, Jorge (28 October 2009).
"Who Killed Camilo Cienfuegos?". Miami New Times. Retrieved 24 August 2023.
Comment: Apologies for the number of hooks. I just found Cienfuegos to be such an interesting character that I found so many examples of potentially interesting Did You Knows.
Improved to Good Article status by
Grnrchst (
talk).
Number of QPQs required: 2. DYK is currently in unreviewed backlog mode and nominator has 32 past nominations.
Post-promotion hook changes
will be logged on the talk page; consider
watching the nomination until the hook appears on the Main Page.
Wow, what a great article. It does an excellent job of describing its complex subject and its context, is impartial, and detailed to a fault. It is a recent GA, QPQs are done, hooks are in the article and referenced; it is hard to pick one, but if pressed I'd go with ALT4, because I feel it represents his character best.
Constantine ✍ 19:08, 23 March 2024 (UTC)reply