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Under the below heading Irgun, there are no numbers relating to the Irgun. There is only 1 sentence relating to the Irgun - the first, ending in "by the British.[44]". Since that paragraph states the Irgun were terrorists, having unrelated information - non-Irgun information - about tens of thousands of Jewish fighters implies they, too, were terrorists. That is prejudicial and incorrect. The sentences of non-irgun information should be moved to the Manpower heading.
Manpower
In November 1947, the Haganah was an underground paramilitary force that had existed as a highly organized, national force, since the Arab riots of 1920–21, and throughout the riots of 1929, Great Uprising of 1936–39,[40] and World War 2. It had a mobile force, the HISH, which had 2,000 full-time fighters (men and women) and 10,000 reservists (all aged between 18 and 25) and an elite unit, the Palmach composed of 2,100 fighters and 1,000 reservists. The reservists trained three or four days a month[citation needed] and went back to civilian life the rest of the time. These mobile forces could rely on a garrison force, the HIM (Heil Mishmar, lit. Guard Corps), composed of people aged over 25. The Yishuv's total strength was around 35,000 with 15,000 to 18,000 fighters and a garrison force of roughly 20,000.[40][43]
Irgun
The Irgun, whose activities were considered by MI5 to be terrorism, was monitored by the British.[44] There were also several thousand men and women who had served in the British Army in World War II who did not serve in any of the underground militias but would provide valuable military experience during the war.[45] Walid Khalidi says the Yishuv had the additional forces of the Jewish Settlement Police, numbering some 12,000, the Gadna Youth Battalions, and the armed settlers.[46] Few of the units had been trained by December 1947.[40] On 5 December 1947, conscription was instituted for all men and women aged between 17 and 25 and by the end of March, 21,000 had been conscripted.[47] On 30 March, the call-up was extended to men and single women aged between 26 to 35. Five days later, a General Mobilization order was issued for all men under 40.[48]
By March 1948, the Yishuv had a numerical superiority, with 35,780 mobilised and deployed troops for the Haganah,[49][50] 3,000 of Stern and Irgun, and a few thousand armed settlers.[51]
71.237.132.211 ( talk) 14:30, 19 September 2014 (UTC)
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To be historically accurate, in 1948, "Palestinian-Arab forces", sited in the article did not exist. 207.237.117.158 ( talk) 15:54, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
207.237.117.158 ( talk) 15:54, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
Not done There is no mention of "Palestinian-Arab forces" in the article - it discusses Palestinian Arabs, the Arab league, and the Arab Liberation Army - all of which did exist. - Arjayay ( talk) 17:18, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
Jordan wanted to annex the area west to the Jordan river. Since the second ceace fire, the frontline in Samaria havent canged almost entirly, the Jordanians belived that they could exploit a silent front with the Israeli front because they didn't want to loose alot of land. In the end they annexed the West Bank and enjoyed the area and the people (gave them citizenship). Isn't it a partial victory? I mean, of course the main official plan was to destroy Israel, but all countries joined the war for their intrests in establishing a united Arab entity or just carving some lands (As Syria wanted the whole "Greater Syria" areas and they belived they could take the Galilee and Egypt wanting to annex the Negev desert). Jordan did managed to earn some of what they wanted and they havent lost to many fights in compare to Egypt.
What I offer is that we will put in the "resaults" section "Jordanian partial victory". Bolter21 ( talk) 21:42, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
"As a result of the war the State of Israel retained the area that the UN General Assembly Resolution 181 had recommended for the proposed Jewish state as well as almost 60% of the area of Arab state proposed by the 1948 Partition Plan.[16]"
I do not know how to interpret this sentence, but any way I do it, the result is nonsense.
The Mandate of Palestine was approximately 47,000 sqmi. Approximately 20% of Palestine was allotted to the Jews, 80% to the new state called Trans-Jordan, the Arab state. So if the Jews ended up with 60% of the Arab allotment, Israel would be 5x the size of Jordan, which it has never been. Area of Israel today: 8,500 sqmi included the annexed regions of Golan and Jerusalem (18% of the Mandate), and the West Bank is 2000 sqmi (4% of the Mandate). Area of Jordan today: 35,500 sqmi (76% of the Mandate). Even if I interpret this as, "after the 1949 Armistice the Jewish area of Israel was 40% of what the UN had allotted to the Jews, while 60% was captured Arab allotments," which is of course NOT what the sentence says, this too is nonsense. I try a third time by seeing if the any Arab group lost 60% of their land, also not what the sentence says, and I find this nowhere.
The sentence leads the reader to conclude that Jews cheated the Arabs by forcibly taking vast areas of land that were Arab, when in fact nothing of a sort ever took place. One has to wonder about the intent of publishing such nonsense.
The map of the Partition is equally misleading. Leaving out Trans-Jordan leaves out 80% of the Mandate. 69.146.183.26 ( talk) 19:54, 31 July 2015 (UTC) 69.146.183.26 ( talk) 19:43, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
Why does the Arab total not include logistics but the Israeli total does? It vastly inflates the numbers. For example, the book "Militarization and State Power in the Arab-Israeli Conflict" gives 45,000 to 70,000 Israeli troops and 94,000 Arab troops. This should really be remedied.-- Monochrome_ Monitor23:33, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
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I checked the link, it's dead for me. Wait, you're a bot aren't you? Don't answer that. To clarify: I'm not claiming that the Arabs greatly outnumbered the Israelis in the war like they did in 67 and 73, I believe the forces were somewhat even numerically at least with it being very possible that there were more Israeli forces later in the war than Arab forces. What I object to is the including of Israeli logistical and combat forces but the including of only Arab combat forces (again, in the source description), which is inherentely unbalanced. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 12:07, 3 September 2015 (UTC) What I'm concerned about is that there are no in-line references to verify the numbers. "knowing them by heart" from a book isn't reassuring. I want to know because I'm genuinely curious. I've looked into it (with a search engine) and have found the classical history (arabs outnumbered israelis in troops and firepower) and the "new history", I guess this article would follow the latter. The dichotomy between them is huge, and frankly unsettling. I'd like a citation from a reliable source that can be easily accessed online. -- Monochrome_ Monitor 12:14, 3 September 2015 (UTC)
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According to the Hebrew version of this article, this war ended on July 20th, 1949, but not on March 10th, 1949. Avi12641 ( talk) 17:54, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
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Should we add a few more sources to the Palestinian Exodus section? Say Benny Morris & other 'New Historians' as they are called in Israel? Merlov1 02:13 AM, 8 April 2015 (UTC)
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Does anyone find it odd that the Nakba article is unprotected? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.18.217.96 ( talk) 23:11, 21 September 2016 (UTC)
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The article states: "In the three years following the war, about 700,000 Jews immigrated to Israel with many of them having been expelled from their previous countries of residence in the Middle East." - Yet the article /info/en/?search=Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_and_Muslim_countries states: "Following the establishment of the State of Israel, a plan to accommodate 600,000 immigrants over four years, doubling the existing Jewish population, was submitted by the Israeli government to the Knesset.[6] The plan, however, encountered mixed reactions; there were those within the Jewish Agency and government who opposed promoting a large-scale emigration movement among Jews whose lives were not in danger.[6]" - So it seems highly biased to say they were "expelled".
144.138.159.159 ( talk) 04:16, 7 October 2016 (UTC)
Hey everyone, I was thinking about adding and taking out information on this page. Also, I though about adding a couple citations. My plans are more detailed below. o Changes to strength
• Final Israeli strength was 113,300, not 117,500. • Add citations Egypt and Iraq. Change number of Syrians to 3,000 and add citation. Transjordan change to 4,500.
o Changes to Military Assessments under Initial line-up of forces, first sentence first paragraph
• The first sentence perpetuates the idea that Israel was an underdog in the fight against the Arabs. -Delete “Though the state of Israel faced the formidable armies of neighboring Arab counties, yet due to previous battles by the middle of May the Palestinians themselves hardly existed as a military force.” -Replace with “Contrary to what most believe, the 1948 war between the Israelis and Arabs was not a clash between David (Israel) and Goliath (Arabs). The Israelis devoted much more man power than those of the Arabs states.” -Delete second paragraph as it is no longer useful or true.
o Under weapons, add how the Arabs at the start of the war had more weapons, but the scale tipped through the war
• Add “As the war progressed, the number of weapons procured by the Israelis increased. Weapons and planes came from America, or were bought and sent to Israel by people like Ehud Avriel.”
All of my information and citations will be from “Israel’s Wars, 1947-93” by Ahron Bregman.
Citation: Bregman, A. (2001). Israel's Wars, 1947-90. New York, NY: Routledge.
If any body had any comments or concerns, please reply on this talk page or mine. Thanks! -- Danrieck ( talk) 22:37, 30 October 2016 (UTC)
The article is tagged as being unbalanced (since 2014) and I have not looked at the archives, nor do I see a discussion relevant to the tag, only concerning errors. If possible I would like to see some discussion concerning this. Otr500 ( talk) 13:21, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
The caption of the photograph in the section Battles of Latrun - Jordanian artillery shelling Jerusalem in 1948 - is disputed. The visual evidence suggests that it is of flares being fired over the Old City. Probably during the failed attack on the Jaffa Gate which coincided with the short lived relief of the Jewish Quarter via the Zion Gate. Padres Hana ( talk) 18:08, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
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The name of al-Husayni is written wrongly "al-Hasayni" once: please correct. Lancioni ( talk) 20:23, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
@ Lancioni: Done, thanks for your contribution. Murph9000 ( talk) 21:19, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
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The article claims that in 1948, "Although the Arab invasion was denounced by the United States, the Soviet Union, and UN secretary-general Trygve Lie, it found support from Taiwan and other UN member states." However, Taiwan was not an independent entity at the time; it was under the control of the Republic of China, which at the time controlled southern China as well as Taiwan. The ROC would only come to rule Taiwan as its own, de facto independent nation starting in 1949. The article would be more responsibly worded with "it found support from the Republic of China and other UN member states". 111.82.114.140 ( talk) 00:35, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
I believe that the two largest Arab armies in the war - Egypt and Transjordan - were both British-funded, British-trained and under significant British influence. To the extent that it is highly unlikely that they could have participated in the war without British consent.
Does anyone have any sources covering this question?
Onceinawhile ( talk) 22:31, 29 August 2017 (UTC)
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I request that "Anyway, the Yishuv perceived the peril of an Arab invasion as threatening its very existence. Having no real knowledge of the Arabs' true military capabilities, the Jews took Arab propaganda literally, preparing for the worst and reacting accordingly."[67]" ["Political Objectives - The Arab League as a whole"] be taken out as it literally repeats what was said right above it at the end of "Political Objectives - Yishuv". 78.100.252.128 ( talk) 16:43, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
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Under "King Abdullah I of Jordan": "While repeating assurances that Jordan would only take areas allocated to a future Arab State, on the eve of war Tawfik Abu al-Huda told the British that were other Arab armies to advance against Israel, Jordan would follow suit." I believe that there should be a "the" inserted into "told the British that were [the] other Arab armies..." Coreybchapman ( talk) 16:56, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
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Change "One of the Egyptian force two main columns" to "One of the Egyptian forces' two main columns" (added an s'). Coreybchapman ( talk) 17:03, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
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Spell "ignores" properly: "This figure ignors the Negev desert which wasn't under any absolute control of either side." Coreybchapman ( talk) 17:19, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
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Under "King Abdullah I of Jordan"
"King Abdullah was the commander of the Arab Legion, the strongest Arab army involved in the war.[74] However, the Egyptian army was the most powerful and threatening army": this is contradictory. The Egyptian army was considered Arab as well, as mentioned in various places in the article below. One should be taken out. Coreybchapman ( talk) 17:00, 8 January 2018 (UTC)
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Please see the RFC discussion at Talk:1948 Palestine war, the outcome of which may impact the name of 1947–48 Civil War in Mandatory Palestine and 1948 Arab–Israeli War as well. Onceinawhile ( talk) 12:19, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
This sentence is obviously incorrect: “Although the Arab invasion was denounced by the United States, the Soviet Union, and UN secretary-general Trygve Lie, it found support from Taiwan and other UN member states.” In 1948, the civil war in China was still going on, and the capital of the Republic of China was just moved from Nanjing to Guangzhou. Taiwan was still just one of the provinces of the Republic of China. So “Taiwan” should be replaced either simply by “China” or, to avoid any possible confusion, by “Republic of China”. De wafelenbak ( talk) 19:42, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
The name of this article should be changed from the 1948 Arab-Israeli War to the Israeli War of Independence. The former name is misleading since more than a fourth of the war took place during 1949. Furthermore, the latter name is used much more widely - thus it's more qualified for WP:UCRN.
Due to the potential controversiality of my suggestion, I'm leaving it open for discussion here before I make the edit. (((TPG))) stalk 20:24, 25 August 2018 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Closing and striking sockpuppet’s proposal, which has been widely discussed very recently Onceinawhile ( talk) 00:48, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
1948 Arab–Israeli War →
Israeli War of Independence – The former name is misleading since more than a fourth of the war took place during 1949. Furthermore, the latter name is used much more widely, making it more qualified for
WP:UCRN. Please note that I'm only requesting that this article be renamed - not the
1947–1949 Palestine war or the
1947–48 Civil War in Mandatory Palestine.
(((TPG
stalk))) 15:21, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
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In the sentense: "Though the state of Israel faced the formidable armies of neighbouring Arab counties..." please replace the word "counties" with "countries". This can be found at the top of the Military assessments section. cannona ( talk) 23:27, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
"Six months after the War of Independence ended, David Ben-Gurion sought to expel more than 10,000 Arabs from the north, for unspecified 'security reasons." [3] can someone enter this article? -- Supreme Deliciousness ( talk) 16:09, 22 December 2018 (UTC)
@ Nableezy: - when the photo in diff was taken - neither East nor West Jerusalem existed, and zones of control inside of Jerusalem were in flux. Jerusalem by itself should be a neutral descriptor (alternately, Old City (Jerusalem) is also accurate and more specific). Icewhiz ( talk) 10:12, 17 January 2019 (UTC)
This recently-added chunk reads as nonsense despite being cited.
The first deaths of the 1948 war occurred on November 30, 1947. Occurring during an ambush of two buses caring Jewish. [4]
How do the deaths occur before the year starts? "caring" = "carrying"? etc. Kellen T 05:38, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
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Some of the facts about the Palestinian Peace contract are false. IOI8921 ( talk) 00:39, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
Please comment here on a bipartisan proposal to help fix the long-running structure/title issue on our articles covering the 1948 war. Onceinawhile ( talk) 13:18, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:1947–1949 Palestine war which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. — RMCD bot 12:00, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
The discussion taking place on the 1947–1949 Palestine war article talkpage affects the title of the current article. I'm wondering why participation in the discussion has been fairly low. ← ZScarpia 21:20, 8 July 2019 (UTC)
Under Course of the war, Southern Negev
"Two of the planes crashed, killing a pilot"
Everything I have read about this operation records that only one plane crashed and three returned safely.
I propose "One of the planes crashed, killing a pilot"
Alan3278 ( talk) 11:10, 27 October 2019 (UTC)
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CHANGE: Lebanon's strength (under "Arab forces" and in the right pane) FROM 1,000 TO 450.
CHANGE: "On 6 June, nearly two brigades of the Arab Liberation Army and the Lebanese Army took Al-Malkiyya and Qadas in what became the only intervention of the Lebanese army during the war" TO "On 6 June, a single brigade of the Lebanese Army took Al-Malkiyya and Qadas in what became the only intervention of the Lebanese army during the war. The Lebanese Army subsequently handed Malikiyya and Qadas over to the Arab Liberation Army on 8 July and returned to its side of the border.
CHANGE: "On 24 October, the IDF launched Operation Hiram and captured the entire upper Galilee area, driving the ALA and Lebanese Army back to Lebanon, and ambushing and destroying an entire Syrian battalion" TO "On 24 October, the IDF launched Operation Hiram and captured the entire upper Galilee area, driving the ALA into Lebanon, and ambushing and destroying an entire Syrian battalion"
CHANGE: "At the end of the month, the IDF had captured the whole of Galilee, driven all Lebanese forces out of Israel, and had advanced 5 miles (8.0 km) into Lebanon to the Litani River, occupying thirteen Lebanese villages. In the village of Hula" TO "At the end of the month, the IDF had captured the whole of Galilee, driven the ALA out of Israel, and had advanced 5 miles (8.0 km) into Lebanon to the Litani River,[202] occupying thirteen Lebanese villages. In the village of Hula"
SOURCE: Hughes, Matthew. (2005). Lebanon's Armed Forces and the Arab-Israeli War, 1948-49. Journal of Palestine Studies - J PALESTINE STUD. 34. 24-41. 10.1525/jps.2005.34.2.024. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/240759698_Lebanon's_Armed_Forces_and_the_Arab-Israeli_War_1948-49 Stork19 ( talk) 03:40, 15 December 2019 (UTC)
CHANGE: "According to Rogan and Shlaim, a token force of 1,000 was committed to the invasion. It crossed into the northern Galilee and was repulsed by Israeli forces." TO "According to Hughes, a token force of 436 was committed to the invasion. It crossed into northern Galilee where it remained for 32 days before withdrawing to its side of the border."
CHANGE: "10,000 Egyptians, 4,500 Jordanians, 3,000 Iraqis, 3,000–6,000 Syrians, 2,000 ALA volunteers, 1,000 Lebanese, and several hundred Saudis" TO "10,000 Egyptians, 4,500 Jordanians, 3,000 Iraqis, 3,000–6,000 Syrians, 2,000 ALA volunteers, 436 Lebanese, and several hundred Saudis" Stork19 ( talk) 10:24, 16 December 2019 (UTC)
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Hello, I signed up specifically to make a comment on this matter after seeing the [citation needed] next to the description of Egyptian forces in the "Initial Line up of Forces" section, because I'm pretty sure I know what the original source is, even if I do not know where that source got it from.
The paragraph in question is as follows:
″In 1948, Egypt's army was able to put a maximum of around 40,000 men into the field, 80% of its military-age male population being unfit for military service and its embryonic logistics system being limited in its ability to support ground forces deployed beyond its borders.[citation needed] Initially, an expeditionary force of 10,000 men was sent to Palestine under the command of Maj. Gen. Ahmed Ali al-Mwawi. This force consisted of five infantry battalions, one armoured battalion equipped with British Light Tank Mk VI and Matilda tanks, one battalion of sixteen 25-pounder guns, a battalion of eight 6-pounder guns and one medium-machine-gun battalion with supporting troops.[citation needed]
The Egyptian Air Force had over 30 Spitfires, 4 Hawker Hurricanes and 20 C47s modified into crude bombers.[citation needed]″
This is almost a direct copy of the following paragraph from Arabs At War by Kenneth M. Pollack:
″Expecting a quick victory over the Jews, Egypt initially dispatched about 10,000 men to Palestine. Although they had had little combat experience during World War II, morale was high among the Egyptians because they had little regard for the fighting qualities of their Jewish opponents. Cairo’s expeditionary force was commanded by Maj. Gen. Ahmed ‘Ali al-Mwawi and consisted of five infantry battalions, an armored battalion with British Mark VI and Matilda tanks, a battalion of sixteen 25-pounder guns, a battery of eight 6-pounder guns, a medium-machine-gun battalion, and supporting troops. In addition, the Egyptian Air Force had over thirty Spitfires and four Hawker Hurricanes operational to support the invasion force in addition to twenty C-47 transports, which Egyptian mechanics had transformed into crude bombers.″
As such, I am almost certain that the source is Pollack's Arabs At War, and suggest that the article be updated to reflect this.
Lazer Raptor ( talk) 14:36, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
New locked article about looting: https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium.highlight.MAGAZINE-jews-looted-arab-property-en-masse-in-48-the-authorities-let-them-1.9201926 Can someone access it and ad the relevant info to the article? -- Supreme Deliciousness ( talk) 06:52, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
According to the article:
Several hours later, Iraq and the neighboring Arab states, Egypt, Transjordan and Syria, invaded the newborn state,[138][139] and immediately attacked Jewish settlements.[17] What was now Israel had already, from 1 April down to 14 May, conducted 8 of its 13 full-scale military operations outside of the area allotted to a Jewish state by partition
This is misleading. I can't find a single example in the article of the Arab states invading the area allotted to the Jewish state. Only entering the area allotted to a Arab state by partition in which Jewish forces were conducting military operations. -- 77.126.61.185 ( talk) 17:05, 13 February 2021 (UTC)
For example, the article clearly states that Jordan only taken areas allocated to a future Arab state. So it is false to say they invaded the newborn Israeli state. In fact, Battel of latrun, in which Jordanian forces were involved, was conducted by Jewish forces inside the area allotted for the Arab state, which suggest that Israel is doing the invading. -- 77.126.61.185 ( talk) 17:22, 13 February 2021 (UTC)
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Rudolf Hortz ( talk) 15:58, 21 May 2021 (UTC)
Can someone find the exact quote from Gelber? In any case I find this particular wording... objectionable. Better possibilities would be "bribes from X", where X is whatever specific Jewish entity did the bribing (Haganah, Lehi, Palmach... even "Yishuv", but do we have to say quote-unquote "Jewish bribes")? Thanks. -- Calthinus ( talk) 22:11, 11 June 2021 (UTC)
two buses carrying two busses ?? 700.000 palestine do not fit in two busses... but correct your spelling plz... 85.149.83.125 ( talk) 14:47, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
The first paragraph currently reads: "The 1948 (or First) Arab–Israeli War was the second and final stage of the 1947–1949 Palestine war. It formally began following the end of the British Mandate for Palestine at midnight on 14 May 1948; the Israeli Declaration of Independence had been issued earlier that day, and a military coalition of Arab states entered the territory of British Palestine in the morning of 15 May."
However, the coalition of Arab states could not have entered the territory of British Palestine in the morning of 15 May, since that territory ceased to exist at midnight on 14 May. On the morning of 15 May, this invaded territory was properly known as Israel (per the Israeli Declaration of Independence).
Accordingly, this paragraph should be revised to refer to the invaded territory as either the former British Palestine or Israel. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Commenter8 ( talk • contribs) 22:53, 1 November 2021 (UTC)
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Want to add a reference Sunstarrrr ( talk) 23:10, 22 November 2021 (UTC)
I want to add the citation of the website https://www.mfa.gov.il/mfa/mfa-archive/1999/pages/focus%20on%20israel-%20machal%20-%20overseas%20volunteers.aspx for the sentence, "On 28 May 1948, Sherut Avir became the Israeli Air Force.[citation needed]."
The first paragraph currently reads: "The 1948 (or First) Arab–Israeli War was the second and final stage of the 1947–1949 Palestine war. It formally began following the end of the British Mandate for Palestine at midnight on 14 May 1948; the Israeli Declaration of Independence had been issued earlier that day, and a military coalition of Arab states entered the territory of British Palestine in the morning of 15 May."
However, the coalition of Arab states could not have entered the territory of British Palestine in the morning of 15 May, since that territory ceased to exist at midnight on 14 May. On the morning of 15 May, this invaded territory was properly known as Israel (per the Israeli Declaration of Independence).
Accordingly, this paragraph should be revised to refer to the invaded territory as either the former British Palestine or Israel. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Commenter8 ( talk • contribs) 13:03, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
As per the IDF history page the events prior to May 1948 should not be considered part of the War of Independence nor be named as such. [1] Additionally you can use http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0761807217/theamericanisraeA/ as reference.
The sentence:"For the first few weeks of the war, Egyptian warplanes were able to bomb Tel Aviv with almost complete impunity, meeting only ground fire. The Egyptians also attacked rural settlements and airfields, though few casualties were caused.[131] Two Royal Egyptian Air Force (REAF) Spitfires bombed Tel Aviv. One of them was shot down by anti-aircraft fire and its pilot taken prisoner. However, the Egyptians continued their bombing raids over the city, killing about 40 people. Most civilian casualties in Tel Aviv occurred on a 18 May raid against the Tel Aviv Central Bus Station.".
Thanks to Pluto's deletion, the reader may be surprised to learn that Tel Aviv arial bombing, belongs to the Negev. The "2 spitfires attack" is missing a date. It does not mentions the Egyption dakotas bombers.
the sentence:"From these positions, the Jordanians were able to cut off supplies to Israeli troops and civilians in Jerusalem"
It is suggested to write that "the Jordanians cut off supplies and water line to Israeli troops and civilians in Jerusalem" (Morris 2008 p. 230-231)
The sentence: "The Jordanians in Latrun cut off supplies to western Jerusalem.".
Proposed: "The Jordanians in Latrun cut off supplies and the water line to western Jerusalem." The sentence:"The Arab Legion fired 10,000 artillery and mortar shells a day'
10000 a day is probably a huge exaggeration.
Cite error: A
list-defined reference named "Woods-Shlaim1996p219" is not used in the content (see the
help page).
Cite error: A
list-defined reference named "Bogdanor2011p82" is not used in the content (see the
help page).
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207.248.199.183 ( talk) 21:36, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
References
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"Operation Brosh was launched in a failed attempt to dislodge Syrian forces from the Eastern Galilee and the Benot Yaakov Bridge. During the operation, 200 Syrians and 100 Israelis were killed. The Israeli Air Force also bombed Damascus for the first time." [1] I would also suggest considering removing the information about the Israeli Air Force, I could not find corroborating information that is reliable or otherwise, and it isn't an essential piece of information about the operation. Kumquat Smoothie ( talk) 06:41, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
References
About the War of Independence:
https://m.knesset.gov.il/EN/About/documents/IndependenceWarEng.pdf
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).I'm a little confused as to why this page has separate "Bibliography" and "Further reading" sections - and what the criteria is for putting things in one place or the other. Since my guess is that there is no good reason, just perpetuated accident, I propose to meld them together.
(I came here to add the Lorch book, which I was a bit astonished to see not listed - as one of the founders of the military history division of the IDF General Staff, his work is as close to an 'official' IDF history of this war as I know of. I added it to "Further reading" section before I realized that there was also a "Bibliography", and thus didn't check to see if it was already there - which it wasn't, thankfully. But that gives a good example of how the two sections are not a good idea.)
At the same time, I notice that Battle for Jerusalem's "Bibliography" has separate "Works by involved parties" and "Secondary sources" sections, which I think is a good idea to import. In addition, the list is quite long, so I would propose adding an "Ancillary works" section, for things like Oren, "Six Days of War", which is about the '67 war, and not focused on this one.
What do people think of this proposal? (Given how contentious the overall area is, I decided not to be bold, even on such a seemingly innocuous point, but to ask here first.) Noel (talk) 12:26, 19 June 2022 (UTC)
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Palestinians to Palestinian. In the 1st sentence of the Arab forces section. Wikiuser552 ( talk) 06:43, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
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Egyptians attacks > Egyptian attacks In the 3rd sentence of the Southern front- Negev section. Wikiuser552 ( talk) 07:50, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
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In the 2nd before last line in the "End of the first phase" secrion the word " injured" is missing after "Jordanians)". Wikiuser552 ( talk) 08:08, 14 June 2022 (UTC)
Until I moved it here, the article had this:
During the 1948 War, 97 Jewish villages were attacked and damaged, resulting in an estimated 60,000 to 70,000 Jews becoming refugees, according to Nurit Cohen-Levinovsky and Benny Morris. [1] [2]
The apparent intention is to present these figures as a counterpoint to the Palestinian refugees. As we will see, this is unjustified, indeed highly misleading. The total Jewish population of the Arab portion of the partition plan (some of which was captured by Israel) was about 10,000, plus there were a few thousand more in the Old City, Atarot and Neve Yaakov that lay in the Jerusalem enclave. All of those people became refugees, but their number was very much less than 60,000 to 70,000. The discrepancy is easy to explain: the high counts include temporary evacuees who returned home after the fighting ended. Such people are not counted as refugees when they are Palestinian, so why should we count them as refugees when they are Jews? Let's look at the references.
"About 70,000 Israeli Jews (10% of Israel’s Jewish population) likewise were uprooted from their homes in UN-mandated Israeli territory. However, after the war, they were able to return to their villages or nearby areas, thus resolving that refugee crisis."So Morris explicitly states that his 70,000 figure is about temporary evacuation. In his book 1948, Morris calls them "refugees" in quotes (p308). (3) A UN document from 1950 that says
"In Israel, the Agency has provided relief to two types of refugees, Jews who fled inside the borders of Israel during the fighting, and Arabs in most instances displaced from one area in Palestine to another. Jewish refugees at first numbered 17,000 but, during the current summer, all but 3,000 of these have been absorbed into the economic life of the new State. Arabs on relief were first numbered at 31,000 but many have been placed in circumstances in which they are self-supporting, so that it was possible to reduce the number to 24,000 at the end of August 1950."(A/1451/Rev.1, p5) These numbers are perfectly plausible but refute the 60,000–70,000 claim.
"The total number of such persons might have been under 10,000. They are more numerous if we include dependents."(No reason given for why dependents were not counted, maybe he meant "descendants".)
Zero talk 09:58, 2 July 2022 (UTC)
References
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I would like to edit this page because it has a error in the infobox conflict. The error is that 'Isreai victory' is put on the numbered list which is not how its supposed to be. We stand for editing ( talk) 23:40, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
{{
edit extended-protected}}
template.
ScottishFinnishRadish (
talk) 23:49, 7 August 2022 (UTC)There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:1947–1948 civil war in Mandatory Palestine which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. — RMCD bot 01:31, 8 October 2022 (UTC)
With this edit, called a tweak, Daveout turns a theory into a 'fact'
The view that this was the first incident has to be attributed to Morris because Laurens states that the violence erupted the day before, on 29 November.
'Le jour meme, les premières violences commencent à Jérusalem. Elles vont a s'étendre dans les jours suivants au reste du pays.' (That same day, the first bouts of violence started up in Jerusalem, and in the following days spread out through the rest of the country) Henry Laurens, La Question de Palestine, Fayard vol.2 2002 p.605; .
'.'Dans les heures qui suivent, un mouvement spontané de violences s'étend à la plus grande partie du pays. Des heurts opposent les deux populations, faisant de nombreuses victims.' Henry Laurens, La Question de Palestine, Fayard vol.3 2007 pp.40-41.
So restore the attribution. Morris's privileging of that incident, self-evidently reflects his nationalist POV, that 'the Palestinians started it'. Nishidani ( talk) 16:19, 18 October 2022 (UTC)
Czechoslovakia defied an embargo to help Israel /info/en/?search=Operation_Balak PreserveOurHistory ( talk) 04:09, 9 December 2022 (UTC)
“ | seven Jews were killed in the Fajja bus attacks by Arab militants in an incident regarded as the first in the civil war.[16] This attack was retaliation to the assassination of five members of an Arab family, suspected of being British informants, by Lehi on 19 November. | ” |
I agree. Removus! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.112.169.114 ( talk) 17:41, 15 January 2023 (UTC)
@ Dovidroth: I noticed this revert citing a lack of discussion, but you do not appear to have opened a discussion yourself. If anything, reversion is more demanding of explanation, so perhaps you would enlighten the talk page. Iskandar323 ( talk) 07:28, 23 February 2023 (UTC)
In 1948 Arab–Israeli War#Military assessments it just says "Martin Van Creveld says that in terms of manpower, the sides were fairly evenly matched." without giving context on who he is. I think the sentence should clarify that Creveld is an Israeli historian and his name should link to his Wikipedia page. Drsmartypants(Smarty M.D) ( talk) 12:42, 9 May 2023 (UTC)
Plan Dalet is mentioned in the article, but no link to an existing article about it is provided. 2A0D:6FC7:441:367C:208F:2CD7:524:D424 ( talk) 09:57, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
The text under the "Northern front – Lake of Galilee" heading claims "On 14 May Syria entered Palestine with the 1st Infantry Brigade." However, the detailed Battles of the Kinarot Valley linked to it says that the Syrians did not enter until 15 May. Mcdruid ( talk) 10:01, 6 August 2023 (UTC)
Reading this article is at times needlessly difficult because a nominally chronological narrative is frequently out of sequence. I assume that happened as successive editors elaborated topically on events and their sequele, and the editors are all so familiar with the events that it’s not confusing to them. In the absence of a masterful reorganization, it would be helpful to use dates instead of comparatives or assigning events to phases of sequences. PolychromePlatypus ( talk) 23:45, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
"seven Jews were killed in the Fajja bus attacks by Arab militants in an incident regarded as the first in the civil war.[16] This attack was retaliation to the assassination of five members of an Arab family, suspected of being British informants, by Lehi on 19 November.[17] "
Reworded. Selfstudier ( talk) 15:12, 4 November 2023 (UTC)
Dovidroth, if you would like to discuss my edits to
1948 Arab–Israeli War#First phase: 15 May – 11 June 1948, which you reverted with the explanation Rv undiscussed, POV changes trying to justify invasion, better before
you are welcome to do so.
The main issue with that section was that the text treated the topic as if there wasn't a war already well under way. As I explained in my edit summaries, (From a different section not relevant to this discussion.
إيان (
talk) 16:53, 27 December 2023 (UTC)) The claim that the Arab armies invaded Israel also fails verification, as the title of the source is literally "The Arab Regular Armies' Invasion of Palestine".
إيان (
talk) 12:16, 20 December 2023 (UTC)
Dershowitz is not a historian and there is no citation for
Morris
.
3 editors (I among them) have taken time to explain the problem—this is wrong. פעמי-עליון made some wild claims without offering any reliable sources in support and then Dovidroth and Homerethegreat piggybacked on it. إيان ( talk) 16:49, 27 December 2023 (UTC)
This reversion [8] should probably be self-reverted and discussed. @ Makeandtoss. IOHANNVSVERVS ( talk) 15:33, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
Regarding the use of the word "enter" or "invade", the sources cited here are as follows:
So it seems to me that using the word "invade(d)" is keeping with the cited sources. Although the object of the invasion should be "Palestine" and not "the newborn state". IOHANNVSVERVS ( talk) 16:19, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
1948 Arab–Israeli War#Air operations cites p. 261 of 1948: A History of the First Arab–Israeli War extensively for claims that are nowhere to be found in that text.
Here is the relevant text for reference so we can collaboratively make sure the section fairly represents the source:
Air and naval operations were also of no great importance in most theaters of operation and battles between 15 May and 11 June 1948. Both Israel and the Arab states lacked serious air and naval capabilities. During the first weeks of the conventional war the Israelis' light aircraft continued to bomb Arab encampments and columns, usually at night to avoid enemy interception, and usually with little effect, except marginally on morale.
However, the Haganah had half a dozen combat-trained pilots, and soon they were joined by dozens of experienced North American, Common-wealth, and Western European flyers, who were to constitute the backbone of the IAF (formerly the Air Service).
The air forces of Egypt, Syria, and Iraq (Jordan and Lebanon had none), though relatively formidable on paper, in fact counted for little. Many of Egypt's fighters and bombers were unserviceable; few of its pilots were competent; ground control, aircraft maintenance, and air intelligence were all poor to appalling. The same applied for the much smaller Syrian and Iraqi air forces. Because of losses and diminishing stocks of ammunition and spare parts, all these air forces contracted during the war.
By contrast, the IAF grew steadily. The first four (Messerschmitt) fighters arrived in mid-May—and went into action on 29 and 30 May. By II June eleven Messerschmitts were operational and by 12 August twenty-five.
The Egyptian air force, using bombers and Spittires, repeatedly attacked Israeli air fields, ground forces, rural settlements, and towns. Few casualties were caused, and these gradually fell off as Israeli air power grew and interception became more effective. In Tel Aviv, which was repeatedly hit by Egyptian air raids, more than forty civilians were killed. Most died on 18 May at the central bus station.
Following the Messerschmitt attacks on the Egyptian and Iraqi columns, Egyptian fighters repeatedly hit Eqron Airfield, where the Israeli fighters were based. On 30 May Egyptian bombers, aiming for 'Eqron, hit the center of the town of Rehovot, including the Sieff (later, Weizmann) Institute, killing seven and wounding thirty. The following day, they hit 'Eqron Air field, hitting two partially assembled Messerschmitts. 373
In part a response to the Egyptian air attacks and in part a gut response to the Jordanian victories at Latrun, Ben-Gurion decided to bomb the Arab capitals. He seemed to think-based on his memories of the German Blitz against London-that air power could prove decisive (though given the poverty of Israeli resources, this was plain silly): "Our air force has to bomb and destroy Amman. The weak link in the Arab coalition is Lebanon.... When we break the [Arab] Legion's power and we bomb Amman, we will also destroy Transjordan, and then Syria will fall. If Egypt will still dare to fight—we will bomb Port Said, Alexandria and Cairo. And thus we will end the war—and pay back for [the treatment of our forefathers by] Egypt, Assyria [that is, ancient Iraq] and Aram [that is, ancient Syria]. "374
In the early morning hours of 1 June, two IAF Rapids and one Bonanza flew to Amman and dropped several dozen fifty-five- and no-pound bombs on the town, the king's palace and the adjacent air field (under British con-trol),375 About a dozen persons died and a number of (British) aircraft were hit. The British warned Israel that if this recurred, they would hit its air fields and aircraft. 376 Israel did not bomb Amman again.
Ten days later, early on In June, hours before the First Truce came into ef-fect, a lone Dakota, loaded to the gills with 176-pound bombs and incendi-aries, took off from 'Eqron, heading for Damascus. It was crewed by seven Britons and South Africans. Flying northward, they could see Haifa to the west, "lit up like a Christmas tree." At 3:12 AM the first bomb was thrown out of the rear door by two crewmen. In all, the plane made six passes over the Syrian capital, delivering sixteen high explosive bombs and ninety four-pound incendiaries, dispersed indiscriminately. The Syrians were caught completely by surprise; they sent up no interceptors, and antiaircraft fire only began ten minutes after the plane had left the area. A Western journalist who witnessed the bombing later wrote that twenty-two Syrians died and more than a hundred were injured, and it "put the fear of God into the inhabitants of Damascus."377 More significant, it forced the Syrians to think seriously about bolstering their air defenses and resulted in a diminution of their aerial activity over Israel during the following bout of fighting, in mid-July. (pp 261--262) إيان ( talk) 14:13, 3 January 2024 (UTC)
Is it just me, or are the images in this article rather one-sided? Here is a list of the images in the article right now, from top to bottom:
That is a lot of pictures of Israeli stuff and very very few pictures of anything non-Israeli... and when "the other side" is depicted, it's most often a picture of "enemy equipment destroyed by Israeli military." I may someday come back and switch out pictures but thought I'd mention it in the meantime. (I left a similar message at Talk:1948 Palestine war.) Levivich ( talk) 22:06, 18 January 2024 (UTC)
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Change "IDF" to "Haganah" or "Irgun" because there was no IDF at that time.
The IDF forces gathered to attack the city numbered around 8,000. It was the first operation where several brigades were involved. The city was attacked from the north via Majdal al-Sadiq and al-Muzayri'a, and from the east via Khulda, al-Qubab, Jimzu and Daniyal. Bombers were also used for the first time in the conflict to bombard the city. The IDF captured the city on 11 July.[188] NJHakim ( talk) 18:43, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
There are apparent inconsistencies around the outbreak of violence in the civil war, and subsequent invasion by foreign forces from Egypt, Transjordan, Syria, and Iraq. In paragraph 3 of the introduction, the article presents a timeline as follows:
In the Background section, the timeline appears inconsistent with this, as it sources information that an Egyptian force organized an embargo of supplies to 100,000 people that precipitated an offensive directly against it:
In the Initial Line-up of Forces section, under Arab forces, Lebanon is listed among the countries, however, Lebanon is omitted from the introduction. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fileyfood500 ( talk • contribs) 07:01, 31 March 2024 (UTC)
Made some recent changes to the infobox results and territorial changes.
Added 1948 Palestinian expulsion and flight though not sure if it belongs there.
- IOHANNVSVERVS ( talk) 19:19, 28 March 2024 (UTC)