- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the miscellaneous page below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result of the discussion was: delete. ‑Scottywong | [babble] || 18:20, 9 October 2019 (UTC)
Portal:Nevada
Neglected portal. Twenty-one never-updated selected articles created in June 2009. Two news headlines are from 2016 and 2017. Mark Schierbecker ( talk) 09:20, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
- Merge and redirect to Portal:United States. We need to rethink our approach here. Rather than deleting content outright, we should generally be merging unsustainable portals up to sustainable ones. bd2412 T 13:17, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
- @ BD2412: I strongly oppose both merger and redirection:
- Portals are not content; they are navigational tools. Since they are wholly unreferenced, they should contain zero original content.
- Merger just means preserving a set outdated of content forks, which is a very bad idea.
- If editors want to use these abominable content forks in a portal on a broader topic, they would do better to create new, up-to-date forks.
- Adding all the topics chosen for a portal on Nevada to a portal on the USA will swamp the latter portal. *Just do quick calculation: ten articles from each of 50 state portals would mean 500 additions to Portal:United States. The one-at-a-time subpage model can't handle that.
- Redirection means that portals links will display a link to a portal which doesn't exist, and then surprise the reader by opening up a portal on a broader topic. Nearly all such redirects have been deleted at RFD for just that reason. It's much better to simply replace the links, as I proposed above. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 18:09, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- Delete and I beg you all to stop hounding me about every portal I ever edited. Delete 'em, burn 'em in effigy, stick 'em in a stew, I don't care. Just please, for the love of all that is good and righteous, stop spamming me. – Juliancolton | Talk 14:53, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
- Note to closing admin. I don't want in any way to prejudge the outcome ... but if you close this discussion as delete, please can you not remove the backlinks? I have an AWB setup which allows me to easily replace them with links to the next most specific portal(s) (in this case Portal:United States), without creating duplicate entries. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 15:53, 1 October 2019 (UTC)
- Delete per nominator, and per the fact there is no good reason to keep portals that are in this condition. Low page views (15/day, compared to 2,493/day for Nevada) and the condition it is in mean zero value is added by such a portal. Portals are not content, being for navigation instead, so it is improper to try to compare dilapidated and useless portals to articles and say they should just be fixed. There is no reason to think that hoped-for improvements and maintenance will ever materialize anyway. The downgrading of POG cuts both ways - there is no policy or guideline which suggests this portal should exist. Simple assertions that the topic is broad enough are entirely subjective; rather, that it is not broad enough is demonstrated by the lack of pageviews and maintenance. Content forks are worthless and should not be saved via merger. A redirect would confuse readers; it is better to replace with a link to the next most specific portal. -Crossroads- ( talk) 02:12, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
Tagged US Portals
| Title | Portal Page Views | Article Page Views | Percent | Comments | Articles | Notes | Baseline | Deleted | Type |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| South Carolina | 12 | 2409 | 0.50% | Originated 2007. Originator inactive since 2013. Last maintenance 2009; articles last tweaked 2016. | 4 | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State | |
| Kentucky | 14 | 2927 | 0.48% | Originated 2006 by editor who last edited 2017. 10 articles, 10 attractions, 14 biographies, 11 cities, no substantive maintenance since 2011. | 45 | Fairly complete calendar, many DYKs. | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State |
| Nevada | 14 | 2600 | 0.54% | Originated 2009. 21 articles created 2009, no substantive maintenance since 2009. | 21 | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State | |
| North Carolina | 16 | 3747 | 0.43% | Originator last edited in 2011 after starting portal in 2006. One featured article at a time without other articles, last tweaked 2013. | 1 | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State | |
| Louisiana | 16 | 3186 | 0.50% | Originator came in 2007, did their thing in 2007, went in 2007. 22 articles and bios originated 2007, some unchanged, some tweaked in or before 2017, no substantive maintenance. | 22 | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State | |
| Tennessee | 18 | 2972 | 0.61% | Originated 2007, originator inactive since 2016. Last maintenance 2011 on six articles and five bios. | 11 | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State | |
| Arkansas | 20 | 2583 | 0.77% | Originated 2008. Originator quit in 2018. Last substantive maintenance in 2009, some articles tweaked. One article tweaked Oct 2019 after MFD. | 21 | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | State | |
| United States | 235 | 42004 | 0.56% | Originated 2005 by sporadic editor. | 101 | Complete calendar. Some articles have obsolete information, such as listing Hilary Clinton as Secretary of State. | Jan19-Feb19 | FALSE | Country |
- Comment - A complete list of metrics for US state portals, including deleted portals, is available at Wikipedia:US State Portal Metrics. Robert McClenon ( talk) 04:19, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
Nevada
- Delete - No substantive maintenance, low viewing, obsolete news.
- Since the Portal Guidelines have been downgraded to the status of an information page and we have no real portal guidelines, we should use common sense, which is discussed in Wikipedia in the essay section Use Common Sense and in the article common sense. The portal guidelines were an effort to codify common sense about portals, and we should still use common sense. It is still a matter of common sense that portals should be about broad subject areas that will attract large numbers of viewers and will attract portal maintainers. This imposes at least a three-part test for portals to satisfy common sense: (1) a broad subject area, demonstrated a posteriori by a breadth of articles (not only by an a priori claim that a topic is broad); (2) a large number of viewers, preferably at least 100 a day, but any portal with fewer than 25 a day can be considered to have failed; (3) portal maintainers, at least two maintainers to provide backup, with a maintenance plan indicating how the portal will be maintained. Any portal that does not pass this common-sense test is not useful as a navigation tool, for showcasing, or otherwise.
- I respectfully disagree with User:BD2412 about changing our deletions of portals to upmerges. They caution against deleting content outright, but portals should not provide unique content. Portals provide arbitrarily selected content that often becomes outdated. There is no need to preserve and build up portals that have what BHG properly calls a Rube Goldberg machine structure. Adding more arbitrarily selected portions of articles to an existing arbitrary selection of portions of articles just increases the Rube Goldberg factor. It will not make the higher-level portals sustainable. The proposed upmerging of portals should not be confused with the upward redirection of backlinks by BHG.
- To User:Mark Schierbecker - This state isn't in the same region of the United States as the other states whose portals you have tagged.
- To the originator of this portal - Twinkle works like that. You can always ignore the courtesy notifications.
- Just delete it. Robert McClenon ( talk) 04:19, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- Yes, I know how Twinkle works. I know it so well, in fact, that I'm aware of how easy it is to uncheck "notify creator if possible"! – Juliancolton | Talk 17:15, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- I would notify Juliancolton that his request was noted, but that would ping him.
User:Mark Schierbecker,
User:BrownHairedGirl,
User:Newshunter12,
User:Nemo bis - As a courtesy, please uncheck that box if the originator is Juliancolton.
Robert McClenon (
talk) 17:27, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- It would take Juliancolton a few seconds to remove the notification if he wants to. I think it's a bad idea to discourage such notifications, and that asking nominators to remember some sort of list of editors who don't want such notifications is an unnecessary burden. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 17:54, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- Thank you (sincerely) for making an effort to accommodate my wishes, Robert. I'm not aware of any "list" of editors who have made a similar request, but I'll take BrownHairedGirl at their word. Deleting portals that nobody's clicked on in 10 years is crucial business and I wouldn't want to impede progress. ;) – Juliancolton | Talk 18:56, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- I would notify Juliancolton that his request was noted, but that would ping him.
User:Mark Schierbecker,
User:BrownHairedGirl,
User:Newshunter12,
User:Nemo bis - As a courtesy, please uncheck that box if the originator is Juliancolton.
Robert McClenon (
talk) 17:27, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- Delete states don't need portals period. Catfurball ( talk) 19:12, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- Delete per nominator, and per Crossroads and Robert McC. This is yet another unmaintained portal, complete with the usual characteristics of abandoned portals: stale content forks, stale news and stale DYKs. (The most recent DYK addition was in 2009. Per WP:DYK, "The DYK section showcases new or expanded articles that are selected through an informal review process. It is not a general trivia section", but the ten-plus year-old set loses the newness, so it is just trivia).
- This whole Rube Goldberg machine model of portal with content-forked subpages is a complete failure. Its sheer complexity poses a huge barrier to potential maintainers, and even if it is maintained it's a huge usability failure. It displays no list of topics on the face of the portal, just an excerpt of one article at a time, and it is absurd to confront readers the whole business of having to purge the page (a counter-intuitive step) just to see one other item from an invisible list whose length isn't even disclosed.
- The head article Nevada is a B-class article. It's absurd to lure readers away from that page to misconceived, abandoned junk like this portal. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 20:11, 2 October 2019 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.