- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was delete. Sandstein 18:18, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
List of political families in Indian cricket administration
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The encyclopaedic value of this article is extremely debatable. What difference does it make whether members of a particular family are appointed to positions in Indian cricket? The fact that people pointed to such positions may be related to politicians or other members of the BCCI administration is pretty trivial, encyclopaedically speaking. – Pee Jay 14:32, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of India-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 14:43, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Cricket-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 14:43, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists of people-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 14:43, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Politics-related deletion discussions. Spiderone 14:44, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Draftify or delete. This is a great example of a list that has both a dubiously notable intersection ("List of brown-eyed CEOs who are less than 6 feet tall" may indeed be citable to RS but why does it matter?) and arbitrary inclusion criteria (what is a "political family"?) It's also extremely short and I don't think much would be lost by its riddance. That said, it does take a stab at asserting notability, which I can imagine being fleshed out into a good article by a dedicated editor.
jp×
g 14:45, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- JPxG, I agree, the article is short. I have added incomplete list template so that other editors be encouraged to add to it. However, in my opinion, this should be a stand alone list backed by reliable sources, otherwise it will lead to violation of WP:NPOV very easily. ChunnuBhai ( talk) 16:31, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Delete per nom. I don't think it's even worth mentioning in the BCCI article, let alone in a stand-alone page.
Lugnuts
Fire Walk with Me 15:17, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Lugnuts, There has been plenty of coverage about different people from political background controlling cricket administration. This would easily pass WP:GNG and WP:LISTN ChunnuBhai ( talk) 16:29, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Keep
- I am the creator of this article. This article was PRODed with three objections which I would like to address.@
PeeJay:
- encyclopaedic relevance. BCCI has monopoly over cricket in India (no WP:POVPUSH intended here, just stating facts) and is the richest member of the ICC. Naturally it's office bearers wield quite a bit of financial power, and in turn influence inside and outside cricket. Some office bearers of BCCI and its member Associations are known faces( Like former cricketers, Industrialists, politicians ). From 2010 to 2014 there have been attempts by the Govt of India to control the BCCI, that have been largely unsuccessful to get through the Parliament. Another interference into BCCI administration came from Supreme Court of India through the Lodha Committee. Its reforms, if they are not being followed, can/should be monitored/addressed by Parliamentarians themselves, and any shortcomings should be highlighted in the public view. Both these events were prominent with plenty of coverage. Therefore this article has encyclopedic value, listing the political control in the cricket administration, whose presence may or may not have been instrumental in keeping BCCI independent of Govt/Judiciary control. Please note the the article itself does not have any of the above allegations and follows NPOV.
- I'm sorry, but if that's your rationale for this being a notable subject then it seems to me like you're trying to smuggle a political agenda in through the back door, especially if you neglect to mention the political aspect. If "we need to keep an eye on who gets elected to positions at the BCCI because some of them are related to politicians" is your reason for creating this list, then it fails
WP:ATTACK; if you remove that from the article, it loses all relevance, since it's not unusual for people who are related to one another to enter similar fields, especially when the BCCI is apparently a route into more mainstream political offices. –
Pee
Jay 16:52, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- PeeJay, My rationale to create this article is that it passes WP:LISTN. I was addressing your point about the page NOT having encyclopaedic value. Also, there is no threat, criticism or unsourced material in the article. The tone of the small lead is quite neutral and not negative. I dont see how it fails WP:ATTACK ChunnuBhai ( talk) 17:00, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- I'm sorry, but if that's your rationale for this being a notable subject then it seems to me like you're trying to smuggle a political agenda in through the back door, especially if you neglect to mention the political aspect. If "we need to keep an eye on who gets elected to positions at the BCCI because some of them are related to politicians" is your reason for creating this list, then it fails
WP:ATTACK; if you remove that from the article, it loses all relevance, since it's not unusual for people who are related to one another to enter similar fields, especially when the BCCI is apparently a route into more mainstream political offices. –
Pee
Jay 16:52, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- It seems like a smear piece. There is no smear campaign here. I agree the list is incomplete right now and many more people can be added from all sides of the political spectrum with citations from WP:RS. This is the reason I put incomplete list template on top of the article so that other editors can add to it (like jp mentions above). I will add more names myself to address this. However this does not attract WP:ATTACK or any related reasons to delete the article.
- perceived nepotism and corruption. PeeJay pointed out on Talk:List_of_political_families_in_Indian_cricket_administration#Contest PROD that two of the citations, that are statements of Rajendra Mal Lodha, mention nepotism and corruption. I will address this by changing the sources. The article itself does not say anything about nepotism or corruption.
- I would also like to highlight that the office bearers are elected, not appointed/nominated by someone, as described in this nomination. Hence people from political background being in Cricket administration is not trivial, but by design.
- This article passes
WP:LISTN. There has been plenty of coverage of politicians and their family members in BCCI and state associations. one example is
[1].
ChunnuBhai (
talk) 16:23, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- If you notice, I haven't mentioned the nepotism or corruption allegations in this nomination, so you don't need to address that further. –
Pee
Jay 16:35, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- I have replaced the sources. ChunnuBhai ( talk) 16:40, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- If you notice, I haven't mentioned the nepotism or corruption allegations in this nomination, so you don't need to address that further. –
Pee
Jay 16:35, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- I am the creator of this article. This article was PRODed with three objections which I would like to address.@
PeeJay:
- Strong delete unless you'll accept my list of blue eyed wicket-keepers born in towns beginning with the letter Q who bat left handed. If there is a real and notable link between politics then this belongs as a paragraph or three in relevant articles, not as a standalone link. I mean, why would this ever, ever, be a suitable subject for a list? I know people dislike actually writing prose because it's too hard, but, please, if it's actually relevant try doing that rather than creating yet another list about subcontinental cricket. Blue Square Thing ( talk) 20:49, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Delete, conjecture, and the list is so slim that the presence of "political families" doesn't seem like a perennial concept in Indian cricket. Geschichte ( talk) 22:15, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
- Delete If this was an important topic there would be an article like Political influence in Indian cricket or, as a minimum, an extensive discussion of the topic in the BCCI article. As it is, it doesn't seem like a suitable topic, remembering that "Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information." Nigej ( talk) 16:22, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
- Delete per WP:OR. Article fails to show any political influence. Shrikanthv ( talk) 06:16, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
- Delete as this is original research. The references do not really support the actual topic itself. Instead they mention X, son of Y is head of so and so cricket board. There is no actual coverage about the intersection of political families and Indian cricket administration. The topic is also highly specific. We could have infinite articles about such intersections - religious leaders and cricket, chefs and cricket, film stars in cricket administration and so on.-- DreamLinker ( talk) 08:28, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
- Delete - I agree with others above that say that this is an intersection with highly questionable notability Spiderone 12:04, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.