The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. The event is notable but probably not the
person, but as no consensus has formed around an alternative title I will leave that open to further discussion.
King of♥♦♣ ♠ 07:43, 12 January 2017 (UTC)reply
But not every criminal case results in a book by a major publisher (
Dundurn Press), and there does seem to be substantial, even international
[1][2][3], coverage. The case would meet
WP:GNG, but not as a biography of Jennifer Pan. Therefore, better to rename to
Murder of Bich Ha Pan and restructure the content accordingly.
Dl2000 (
talk) 03:51, 30 December 2016 (UTC)reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America1000 00:31, 5 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete - Jennifer Pan is not independently notable, but I can see an article on the
Murder of Bieh Ha Pan. That article would need to be written differently than a bio of Jennifer though, so my vote is still a "delete" for this article, though with no prejudice about the creation of a new "murder of..." article.
Fyddlestix (
talk) 17:08, 5 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Article has been completely rewritten, expanded, sources, contectualizes - with sole exceptio of lede & infobox, satisfying this demand.
E.M.Gregory (
talk) 20:58, 11 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep and consider Rename. Article is so badly written that an editor unfamiliar with this murder would assume that it was a family tragedy when In fact, this was anything but a "routine" murder due to the way it was treated by the press and by the East Asian immigrant community, see for example: Tragedy of ‘golden’ daughter’s fall resonates with Asian immigrant children,[4] in the
Washington Post.
E.M.Gregory (
talk) 13:14, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Note that it is far more efficient to keep the article and rename it, than to delete the sources and hope that someone starts all over again.
E.M.Gregory (
talk) 13:14, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Note that a Canadian journalist is out with a "true crime" book on this murder; a thing publishers and journalists do only when a crime is pre-sold. i.e. notable.
E.M.Gregory (
talk) 14:46, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
WP:HEYMANN I expanded article form stub to give some idea of the scope and impact of this murder. However, I did nothing to the lede or the infobox, pending outcome of this discussion. Article needs a new title, and a lede revised according to the new title. Note that the case became notorious because of the idea that culturally-specific Chinese
Tiger parenting and the pressure on children of Chinese immigrants to be perfect backfired here into a tragic murder. Naming it after the book won't work, reason is: there is a book, but it got panned. Also, an article by a journalist who was a high school classmate of the "golden daughter" is said to have launched the incident into notoriety, so it's hardly fair to name the article after a book written by a different journalist. That article was written almost 5 years after the murder occurred, until then this murder relatively routine regional press attention. Frankly, I don't know what to call it. I can't find any sources calling it
Murder of Bieh Ha Pan, PRESS ATTENTION is focused almost entirely on the daughter, the family relationship and "tiger parenting."
E.M.Gregory (
talk) 19:25, 9 January 2017 (UTC)@
[email protected],
Dl2000, and
Fyddlestix:reply
Keep and rename to focus on the crime/trial, which is the true thing that's notable here. ----
Patar knight - chat/contributions 23:52, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Good point, something like
Trial of Jennifer Pan or
Jennifer Pan Murder Case might work. Although it is the mother who was killed, the sources focus on Jennifer and her remarkable trajectory of fabulism, and on her relationship with her father, the "tiger Dad".
E.M.Gregory (
talk) 22:39, 10 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep and agree with recommendations to rename the article and format the article to fit the crime itself. This topic has significant media attention from established, reputable secondary sources like CBC, Toronto Life, etc that warrants sufficient notability for
WP:GNG.
Cyali (
talk) 21:27, 10 January 2017 (UTC)reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.