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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Only one person supports keeping. Sandstein 13:28, 1 May 2018 (UTC) reply

Carlos Nicholas Fernandes

Carlos Nicholas Fernandes (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
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Most coverage is (near) identical to the article about his company InstantTV. Insufficient editorial coverage about the person independent of the company. Most sources about his engagement in various bodies are primary, which is not sufficient for WP:BASIC. Lacking depth of coverage and independent coverage. Trivial corporate business reporting (such as reports about legal issues) does not establish personal notability. Additionally, there's a certain promotional slant to the article about both company and person. pseudonym Jake Brockman talk 10:37, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Businesspeople-related deletion discussions. pseudonym Jake Brockman talk 10:38, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Internet-related deletion discussions. pseudonym Jake Brockman talk 10:38, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Singapore-related deletion discussions. pseudonym Jake Brockman talk 10:38, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Fernandes was named Young Global Leader by the World Economic Forum. Young Global Leaders have had to have a significant level of impact in order to be selected. For example, Jimmy Wales, Mark Zuckerberg and Marissa Mayer are also Young Global Leaders. More information on Young Global Leaders according to the World Economic Forum themselves is at on Youtube [1]. Techcrunch [2] lists some members and the World Bank [3] notes the selection process where selected members of about 100 are drawn from a pool of 8000 candidates. While I am not suggesting Fernandes has the same level of name recognition, surely he would be qualify for a Wikipedia entry.
    Just Googling his name points to interviews at the World Economic Forum annual summit in Davos [4] [5]. Very few people individually take on large corporations for a larger public interest goal (and more so in Singapore) so I believe he qualifies. Further, he not only invented the cloud-based DVR, but he also successfully ensured it was recognised as a legal offering. It's impossible to decouple RecordTV/InstantTV from Carlos Fernandes. That said, if you feel some parts are promotional, please feel free to remove those parts. I will add other details on other projects as well.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 11:42, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply

References

  1. ^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwUMVP77cT8
  2. ^ https://techcrunch.com/2009/02/25/world-economic-forum-announces-new-batch-of-young-global-leaders-mark-zuckerberg-chad-hurley-kevin-rose-and-more/
  3. ^ http://web.worldbank.org/archive/website00818/WEB/OTHER/EXCEPTIO.HTM
  4. ^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpFHE91mIDo
  5. ^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk7DSwhnD4Y
  • Updated Awards and Distinctions section indicating him being an academy member on the $1 Million Prize Global Teacher Prize [1]. Also included references to other work and interviews in Davos. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 13:16, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
@ Twistedmind88: He is clearly a very busy business man, he is involved in many things, has done some good things and has media presence. However notability is not just about that. For an individual, it is about if the person is being talked about elsewhere, as opposed to the person talking about things. One would expect for a Singaporean business man of notability that Straits Times reports about him. A search for "Carlos Fernandes" and "Carlos Nicholas Fernandes" did not give any relevant hits about this person. For me personally, in a relatively small community like Singapore (or HK, UAE etc likewise), a primary notability test is if the leading English language paper reports about the person.
At the end of the day, there are many corporate leaders doing their job: running a company, networking, sharing thoughts and opinions about business today and in the future, be this at Davos on TV or elsewhere.
To put this into perspective: if I have done the research right, out of the 100 YGL in 2017, 13 have Wikipedia articles. Most seemed notable before being called on YGL. The Global Teacher Prize (for the record, he is not a winner, he is a member of the team of people deciding the winner), is over 200 people strong. I spot checked the first 20 in the list and found 5 with articles on Wikipedia, 3 of which are tagged with problems such as lacking sources or notability.
As the Basic notability rule states: primary sources (which are the YGL or Teachers Prize websites) do not count towards notability. There's also no notability by association ("I'm in a list with a notable person, so I must also be notable" does not work). To establish notability, there need to be secondary editorial sources, i.e. this needs to be talked about. pseudonym Jake Brockman talk 15:55, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Your point about him being covered by the Straits Times is fair. He has been covered numerous times including front page coverage. The problem is that a lot of that content has been removed from the website because Straits times has a pay wall and a monopoly on news. So some of it is available only from reposts on blogs. For example, if you do a search on the National Library Website and look for the newspaper for Business Times (the Business Edition of the Straits Times), 2 December 2010 you will find a reference to the article on him. This warranted front page coverage. It is no longer available except through an old repost on asiaone. Is there a way to temporarily show articles (and there are many) to establish notability - possibly by displaying them on a third party website? Of course, these couldn't be used ON Wikipedia (for copyright reasons), but they could be used to establish notability FOR Wikipedia?
  • He's also been spoken about (notable) - by the Minister in Singapore as a man who has "made his mark" [2] on the country. This was covered extensively by the press too, but now only the original press release from the Government is visible. That said, as per the correct definition of notability you use, this should work.
  • He was also significantly covered following the Singapore Computer Society Young Professional of the Year Award in the press, but those articles aren't visible unless, I can share pictures of copies of articles from the National Library.
  • Global Agenda Councils (and the new name - "Global Future Councils") are a level higher than Young Global Leaders, since they do not have an age constraint. If you could check research there, I'd imagine the number of individuals with Wikipedia pages from that list would be a significantly higher percentage.
  • Finally, Carlos Fernandes is a very common hispanic name. The correct search item on Google would be "Carlos Fernandes Singapore". — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 17:01, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Try going to http://eresources.nlb.gov.sg/newspapers/ and searching for "Carlos Fernandes Singapore". You will get over 50 hits - out of which at least 30 are about him. You unfortunately can't read the articles. If you Google the headlines of the articles, you will see virtually no hits, because of the way Singapore news works. If you need access to the actual documents, they are available from the library and I can probably help get them for you, but I trust that would not be necessary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 17:08, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Just in case it helps, Fernandes was one of the few "industry leaders" (a term used by ASEAN - the Association of South East Asian Nations) invited [3] to speak to ASEAN IT Ministers at the 3rd ASEAN Telecommunications and Information Technology Ministers Meeting, Singapore. Other speakers included the the then CEO of Singtel Lee Hsien Yang. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 17:21, 5 April 2018 (UTC) reply

@Jake_Brockman Here are some press links. These do not show up on Google. See:

  • Two S'poreans named among WEF's global leaders [4].
  • Appeals Court hits RecordTV Play button [5].
  • Record TV shows with an online VCR [6]
  • Spore firm offers free trial for online video recorder service [7].
  • Ideas Man with a zest for life [8].
  • Doing Business with the Big Boys [9]
  • His software is so smart the computer is almost human [10].
  • IT Leaders push the limits. Fernandes is center featured. [11]
  • Can-do Carlos! [12]
  • Hail the IT Heroes [13]

@Jake_Brockman Trust your points have been adequately addressed. can we close this issue? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 10:48, 10 April 2018 (UTC) reply

References

  1. ^ http://www.globalteacherprize.org/academy-member/carlos-fernandes/
  2. ^ /info/en/?search=Carlos_Nicholas_Fernandes#cite_note-12
  3. ^ http://asean.org/joint-media-statement-of-the-3rd-asean-telecommunications-and-information-technology-ministers-meeting-singapore-19-september-2003/
  4. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GN0l3dHFLY3gxazA/view?usp=sharing
  5. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GWFh2VU5WUGFIOTg/view?usp=sharing
  6. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GQXQyV0g0V05YbVE/view?usp=sharing
  7. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GUFpKeEFIZTc5WDQ/view?usp=sharing
  8. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GNE1NRXNILVhUa0k/view?usp=sharing
  9. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GekZ6Q1NLak0xTkk/view?usp=sharing
  10. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GbE93Um5jLWFoMEk/view?usp=sharing
  11. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GNnI5b2w4RUN5Ymc/view?usp=sharing
  12. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GanAyRW41akRlY3M/view?usp=sharing
  13. ^ https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8oAS_iKSo8GV0tMSzR2TFRXVlU/view?usp=sharing
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: We need some actual "keep" or "delete" opinions here.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 06:26, 15 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Delete. no independent notability "Young Global Leader" is in my opinion a minor part of the WEF's elaborate self-promotion scheme, and of no encyclopedic significance. DGG ( talk ) 21:09, 18 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Keep. notability established through various other press that has been independently added. Young Global leader is just one part. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 05:18, 23 April 2018 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 08:18, 23 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Delete per lack of substantial coverage in reliavle independent sources. FloridaArmy ( talk) 08:52, 23 April 2018 (UTC) reply
  • Has anyone claiming "delete" read the articles included on Google Drive?? Singapore is a media monopoly and does not keep news available publicly on the web. This issue of independent sources was raised and I have gotten the articles and hosted them on Google drive. Please kindly review the articles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Twistedmind88 ( talk • contribs) 01:00, 24 April 2018 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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