- The single "
Confide in Me" added in the lead section, "
Can't Get You Out of My Head" charting at #1 in forty countries being mentioned (questionable, since the reference didn't state which those 40 countries were), Minogue being the only female artist to achieve a top 10 single in 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s and 20s in the
UK Singles Chart, being removed in the lead section, "Padam Padam" being called as a "recording comeback", which is false as Minogue released new music in 2020 and 2021, just a few years before "Padam Padam" and had number one albums in 2018/19/20 in Australia and the UK. Several mentioned of specific years being removed from the lead section. Its not an improvement, in my opinion.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 01:39, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- And what exactly is your argument for omitting "Confide In Me" as a mention?
- What part of WP policy states that the specific countries need to be mentioned? The source is from a world famous newspaper with high integrity. Unless you can prove that
The Guardian is a bad source.
- Removed because SYNT from source.
- "
Hung Up" by Madonna is frequently cited as a comeback for her despite that she was releasing singles from 2000-2005, so that argument is null. Like I said, prove that The Guardian is a bad source and I'll be happy to remove it.
Wikipedia:Reliable_sources/Perennial_sources#Sources
- I don't see you arguing to add specific years to all of her singles like Love at First Sight and Slow?? Ano problema mo??
-
PHShanghai | they/them (
talk) 06:16, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- "
Padam Padam" isn't a recording comeback when she released new music in 2018 to 2021. Also, you keep bringing up SYNT, when you couldn't even argue that there is another female artist other than Kylie Minogue, that managed to have a top ten single in the 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s and 20s in the Uk Singles Chart. Your continuous dismissal for that achievement really shows how you are only basing these changes in your own preference only.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 06:22, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- Also, the only change I am okay with is mentioning "Confide in Me". It still needs better wording. The rest of the changes, don't really improve the lead section in any shape of form. "Padam Padam" being called a "recording comeback" whether its from a respected magazine, is still an opinion from a single journalist. That shouldn't be written in the lead section. While Kylie Minogue achieving a UK top ten single in the 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s and 20s, isn't based on an opinion from someone else, but a fact published by the
The Official Charts which are based from the music industry results coming from public sales/streaming. As for Tension's "critical acclaim", Minogue's previous album Disco was well received by critics as well, which was included in several year-end lists for albums, but its not highlighted in the lead section. So Tension shouldn't be as well.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 07:59, 19 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- 1. Extra sources:
-
Queerty:
Kylie Minogue’s comeback with summer anthem “Padam Padam” shows no signs of slowing up.
-
News24:
Padam Padam is the pop pixie’s banger of a comeback single that has everyone from nine to 90 hooked and it’s thrust her firmly back into the charts.
-
Evening Standard:
Kylie Minogue is officially back! Her comeback single Padam Padam arrives as a first teaser to newly announced album Tension – and unsurprisingly, it’s a dancefloor-ready gem.
-
PinkNews:
Kylie’s comeback appears to mark a similar shift. With “Padam Padam”, she is looking likely to have her biggest British hit in nearly a decade.
- 2. OCC says that she is the fourth female artist to receive a top ten hit in five consecutive decades; that is all the source said and to change the context (which you are arguing for) would be
WP:OR.
- 3. Disco has a MC score of 72, indicating "positive reviews". Tension has a MC score of 86, indicating "widespread acclaim". It is objective truth Tension is objectively scored way higher than Disco and currently Kylie's only "universally acclaimed" album on Metacritic. It is boggling me how you want to remove her critical success; there is a difference between positive reviews and critical acclaim.
PHShanghai | they/them (
talk) 10:19, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- At this point, no one is agreeing with you. Time to give it a rest.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 14:10, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- Personal attacks instead of actually countering my points that I've based in policy and have given references to.
- Maybe when you stop your clear
WP:OWN issues that many people have complained about; you actually could be doing anything constructive and not resorting to
petty, insignificant attacks.
PHShanghai | they/them (
talk) 14:18, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- You're accusing me of attacking you, when you yourself accused me of so many things (please read your comments towards about me). Also you can clearly see in this talk page that I wasn't the only one who didn't see your proposed changes as an improvement. We've been discussing about this for more than 48 hours, and no one has agreed with your proposed changes. Let it go.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 14:25, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- It isn't an accusation when several other editors have confronted you of
WP:OWN issues on this particular article specifically. That isn't an accusation that's just the plain cold truth. Speaking of which, why are you still avoiding actually responding to the facts I've listed? (Tension is her highest, most acclaimed album.)
- Additionally, that isn't how RfCs work. The only other person who's opposed the argument is someone whos mainly edits talk pages; and consensus isn't determined based on numbers, but the strength of arguments.
- It seems more like you want to avoid constructive consensus and you keep resorting to ad hominem attacks. Other editors have called out your passive-aggressive rudeness; it isn't just me.
PHShanghai | they/them (
talk) 14:36, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- I haven't been blocked or warned about owning an article. So you suddenly making this about me and personally attacking me, are both inappropriate and not healthy towards me.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 15:35, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
- Also I think I am done with communicating with you. I think we've exhausted this topic. I don't agree with your changes and thats that. And since I've been personal attacked several by you in this talk page, I think my next step, would be to file a report against you.
TheHotwiki (
talk) 15:44, 20 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
-
Talk:Kylie_Minogue#Opening_paragraphs: "First things first, calm down and stop being passive-aggressive about it. Neither you nor I own ANY article on Wikipedia."
- You've been a passive aggressive editor this entire time. Not only that; Wikipedia is built on consensus. Literally admitting "I don't agree with your changes therefore you cannot make any changes" straight up violates
WP:OWN.
- And are we even going to talk about that
WP:INTIM statement?
PHShanghai | they/them (
talk) 00:18, 21 October 2023 (UTC)
reply
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