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Hello! Given ongoing discussions and recent edit warring – and with the hope of resolving this issue – you might be interested in a poll currently underway to decide the rendition of the lead for the Republic of Macedonia article. Please weigh in! Bitola | talk | 01:04, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
Kosovo is under UN administration and Serbia has neither legal nor factual control over it. Kosovo should be covered blue in the map (the UN color) not to misslead the public. It shouldn't be light pink like other states around. Blue is the best as it signifies that there is a connection with Serbia, but at the same time it points out that there is UN presence.
Most of these arguments had had absolutely nothing to do with the article's purpose, which was Serbia and its basic background (historic, geoografic and other data). These political arguments should be resettled to some other article's discussion topic (such as WWI, WWII, Kosovo and Kosovo war, just to name a few). [1]- this is the official Census that was carried out back in 2002 which shows exact official population figures for the country's inhabited places. The Serbia page is beeing constantly revised (population-wise), when it comes to the country's largest cities. Last time this happened showed that Belgrade had had only 1,1 million people (!!!) which is quite redicilous taking that Belgrade became a city of million back in the 1960's. In 1991 the population top was 1,800,000 however many have moved out since due to economic collapse and wars, so the OFFICIAL population (check!) dropped to 1,576,890. However taking that the country hosts more than 700,000 refugees out of which most live in Belgrade's suburbs and are not registered, number of people is considered to fluctuate between 1,9 and 2,1 million. Please check out the Census 2002 for more info. NeroN_BG
For NeroN BG: Please do not delete the talk page content again. I agree that content of this page could be archived, but not deleted. As for population of Belgrade, problem with that is that population figures founded in different sources show population number for different areas: historical Belgrade (excluding Zemun and New Belgrade), present-day urban Belgrade (including Zemun and New Belgrade), and entire administrative area of the Belgrade City District. If you say that during the 1960's Belgrade had million inhabitants you should know about which of these 3 Belgrade areas you speak. PANONIAN (talk) 15:30, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
For the Ukrainian language, see this:
Quote; "The Statute of AP Vojvodina stipilates that the official languages, besides Serbian, are Hungarian, Slovak, Rumanian, Ruthenian and Croatian." So, Ukrainian is not official regional language according to this official site.
For the first results from 2002 census, see this:
For the final results from 2002 census (a corrected figure from first results, thus more accurate) see this:
The last numbers posted for city population figures are these final results. PANONIAN (talk) 16:36, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
Now, since the previous PDF document show only final 2002 census results for municipalities, here is one which show results for settlements. However, only part of this document is here (if somebody want the entire document he should to buy the CD with that document in the Republic Statistical Office in Belgrade, like I did):
Here is the population of Belgrade (according to that document):
PANONIAN (talk) 17:06, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
As for Kosovo, this is the best site where population of the cities of Kosovo could be seen:
Our Wikipedia article use previous estimation of this web site from 2002, which is not shown there any more. PANONIAN (talk) 17:11, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
See the Hipis seit:
Everybody,who doesn´t accept UNMIK , but is writing for kosovo, is just making propaganda. it has nothing to do with english language. With people like that, i don t need to have a discussion. If you are able to accept UNMIK, than we can have a discussion.
First of all : UNMIK ! What does it mean ? UNMIK stands for United Nation Mission in KOSOVO. In Kosovo ! There are no words for Serbian teritory or things like that. If you would be so nice, to have a look to the homepage from UNMIK, you can see yourself : there are no words for Kosovo in serbian territory . They are just writing " ...in the war-ravaged province [2] of Kosovo... " Than you can read this :
That means, Kosovo doesn t have a status( it s war - ravaged ! ). It s just a province, administrated by UNMIK,and nothing else. It doesn t belong to any other state or country. UNMIK is there to help the kosovars to decide for their future.Every other offical reference, like offical serbian - or offical albanian reference, is just propaganda. From that point of knowledge, our discussion is, like I would say Serbia or Albania is a province in China. All articles with the subject " Kosovo ", which have to do with information or references BEFORE the 10. june 1999 belongs to the article " History of Kosovo ". In an other case, I ll delete it , because i took it like propaganda and not like neutral information for Wikipedia. People in this discussion, who don t accept UNMIK, aren t neutral. They are living in an own dreamworld, what has nothing to do with reallity and they are using the Wikipedia for their own propaganda.
If somebody think, that I m wrong, please show me. But please argue with informations from an OFFICIAL document, accepted from UNMIK and not with an dokument from national offical propaganda informations. We can have a disskussion with facts from UNMIK, not with the past. Wikipedia stands for knowledge and shouldn t have to become a place for national propaganda, no matter if it s serbian or albanian propaganda. In other case serbian and albanian people will ravage it, like they ve ravaged Kosovo.-- Hipi Zhdripi 21:01, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)
You should fix Serbian coat of arm
Population – Total (2002) (not including data for Kosovo and Metohia Province) – Density
7.498.001
126.83/km²
Oficel name of Kosovo is not Kosovo. You must user in English mape. Take a look to the Soc. Rep. Fed. of Yogoslavia. Kosovo is not a Subdivison is a elemt of the state Yogoslavia. The presiden of Yogoslavia it was a Albaner representin kosovo.-- 172.173.56.105 02:20, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
In year 2006 the name Serbia is mening the green feeld. New York City is not a same with New York State-- Vete 02:34, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
The Kosovo parliament is not in the Serbian parlament see: National Assembly of Serbia-- Vete 02:43, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
Nobody becase they don belong to Serbia-- Vete 02:45, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
Is not bording to Albania but to Kosovo. See the Mape.
Pleace dont removie the {{POV}}. This articel unter this name is wrong. We most ha to artikels one about the "littel Serbia" and the "Great Serbia". Litel serbia is maining the word Serbia how the english user andrerstand and the Word "Great Serbia" is the SR of Serbia with thre elements "littel Serbia (mala or kratka Serbia), Vojvodina and Kosovo. The thre have a differen parliaments and make together the national parliament of Grat Serbia. They hawe the teritorial army (MUP Serbie, MUP Vojvodina and TM Kosovo) . They have thre Court Laws with seeats in Belgrad, Novi Sad and Pristina. All this thre parlament must make the national asembla of Great Serbia. Milosevi has destroid the asembla of Great Serbia now we have only to Kosovo Court Laws and the New Serbia Court Law in Belgrad. For thet take a look of maps.
Pleace dont rev. till you dont have a argumet that is not true. We mos desait wat is mainig the word Serbia, Serbia als Litel Serbia, New Serbia or we disaid to do like in Wien. To place Kosovos articel unter the UN mandat and in the articel Serbia to put a notice this artike is about the New Serbia.
The war in Serbia after the Kosovo War it was ther and is wery importen becose the UN has maket the res. abuit that. About the ctys in south serbia. The citis of Preseva, bujanoc and Medvedje. And the nomber of the albaniens in serbia we must put ther. They live ther and they are importen element in south serbia bordien to Bonsteel (US Base). It is the key of the bakan war. In the northen of this territori it was the war Serbian-Kosovar ( UÇKMB) and in south Macedonian-albanians from Macedonia , war.
Hipi Zhdripi˘s arguments: http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N01/298/89/PDF/N0129889.pdf?OpenElement Welcoming the steps taken by the Government of the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia to consolidate a multiethnic society within its borders, and expressing its full support for the further development of this process, Also welcoming the plan put forward by the Government of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia to resolve peacefully the crisis in certain municipalities in southern Serbia (Preseva, Bujanoc ect, after Kosovo War it was war in this citys and i Macedonia), and expressing encouragement for the implementation of political and economic reforms designed to reintegrate the ethnic Albanian population as full members of civil society,
Welcoming international efforts, including those of the United Nations Interim Administration Mission in Kosovo, the International security presence in Kosovo (KFOR), the European Union, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, and the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) in cooperation with the Governments of the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia and other States, to prevent the escalation of ethnic tensions in the area,
Wat is that. I can not anderstend is a provinc, teritory or wat ? All the articel is confius. Is this Serbia or Great Serbia o centarl Serbia? -- Hipi Zhdripi 19:23, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
Hier is no word abaut the Vojvodina and Kosovo? A supose that this secsion it mus be unter the articel "Littel Serbia". Hier it must bee Kosovo and Vojvodina if you dont wont that the Kosovo to be representit unter the UN flag.-- Hipi Zhdripi 19:30, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
You dont have to give me an intelligent answer, you must see the Image is talkin better then I.-- Hipi Zhdripi 20:11, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
We most put in this articel {{otheruses}} and make " Great Serbia or samthing ells, but how is now, has no sence-- Hipi Zhdripi 20:15, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
This it must be part of the aricel "Litel Serbia"-- Hipi Zhdripi 20:17, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
I dont know so gut nglish but they in this page they know english. See http://www.axisglobe.com/article.asp?article=689
Well, I understand something, but not all, you should improve your English. This article is about present day Republic of Serbia. Another article you proposing would be one about "Socialist Republic of Serbia" as it was the name of one of the republics of SFRY. I do not see why such article should not be written. As for these 2 maps, they should stay here until the final status of Kosovo is defined, and then we will remove them if Kosovo is declared independent (just wait few more months, ok?). As for the current status of Kosovo, since you said that Kosovo is a province, every province is part of something, so if it is not part of something then it would be named simply "territory" but certainly not province. As I said, wait few months, and then we will discuss this. PANONIAN (talk) 01:28, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
Oh, isn't it pretty obvious that Kosovo will become independent... I'm extremely sad because of that, but it will be so. This has been planned since Tito died, maybe even before that. The West wants Kosovo for the raw materials, and the Albanians, unlike the Serbs, want to privatize everything and practically give Westerners anything they want... Sure, we can wait a few more months, but that'll just make the agony longer... It's better just not to mention Kosovo at all, the whole world is watching how we're losing our holy land... This is going to continue untill Serbia = Beogradski pasaluk. -- ςerbiana ♫ 05:11, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
Involvement of the various state organs and institutions of the Republic of Serbia in the wars in Bosnia and Croatia 1991-95 is a fact well-known to anyone with more than superficial knowledge of those wars. The institutions concerned were, among others, Ministry of Internal Affairs, State Security Service, Ministry of Finance, Public Accounting Service (SDK), Territorial Defence of Serbia etc. Omitting it completely from this article makes it incomplete and POV. -- Elephantus 20:01, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
You mean:
I find a problem with "directing". It's unclear whether it refers to all of those or just some. While I don't dispute that Belgrade had influence to war plans of accross-Drina Serbs, personally, I don't think they ordered e.g. Srebrenica massacre.
Likeways, a little rephrasel is needed, though. -- HolyRomanEmperor 20:56, 12 April 2006 (UTC)
The main problem here is whether really the "various state organs and institutions of the Republic of Serbia" or just a individuals who lead these institutions were involved in civil wars in neighbouring countries. Since Serbia was not in the official state of war during that time, the participation of Serbia in any war was against the Serbian law. Thus, if people who lead state institutions abused power and broke Serbian law that does not mean that state of Serbia was involved in these wars, but these individuals. Thus, this is wrong article to write about their connections with wars. PANONIAN (talk) 02:38, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
Please spare us the version of history written by fascist HDZ political party which is currently on power in Croatia. They invented story that Serbia attacked Croatia only to find excuse for 300,000 Serbs who were expelled from Croatia. The current sentence in the article is NPOV and I expect that you do not change it any more or post ridiculous references. PANONIAN (talk) 14:26, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
Yes, there was no such opposition because SERBIA DID NOT PARTICIPATED IN THESE WARS. Or do I have to draw that for you? It was JNA (Yugoslav Peoples Army) which was in war with Croatian separatists. Later when that army left from Croatia it armed lokal Serbs instead to left them with no arms to Croatian fascists slaughter them all. The story about "Greater Serbia" is simply stupid because the only political party in Serbia that supported Greater Serbia was Serbian Radical Party, and this party was in power only during Kosovo war in 1999. PANONIAN (talk) 15:43, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
By the way, Elephantus, did you know that Serbian Radical Party criticized Serbian government during these wars that it does not want to help to Serbs in Croatia and Bosnia? I have good memory and I remember these things no matter what Franjo Tuđman said in his speech in Croatia. PANONIAN (talk) 16:12, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
To PANONIAN: According to your own proposed link, as well as mine, it shows that Belgrade has a population of 1,576,124, out of which city proper has 1,281,801 (NOT 1,119,642, don't know where u got that from), and the rest of the city has 294,323, rising the figure to 1,576,124. Of course New Belgrade and Zemun are counted as well, because modern Belgrade is, as you know, city that has united with Zemun back in 1931, and with New Belgrade upon its foundation in 1948. In close future, next 20-30 years it is generally expected that city of Pancevo will also join the conurbation. These are all, of course, official numbers, which count both Belgrade's temporary and constant residents. The problem is that tens of thousands of refugees live unregistered and are not subject to official Census, as well as the dwellers who move in the city in thousands looking for work. It is estimated that out of 700,000 refugees that Serbia has recieved during the '90s about one half settled in Belgrade, many of whom have registered but yet many still expect further advancement in their housing status (Kosovo and Croatia refugees). Municipalities such as Kaludjerica, Batajnica and Surcin alone count for 200,000 people, most of them refugees, in houses that are not even legalized nor there are any signs that it will happen in near future...so when you say 1,119,642... most of the people would just laugh. Belgrade region, which surpasses the city limits, counts for 1,717,988 people but it's generally accepted that Belgrade houses near 2 million residents. It is an estimation based on both official Census and the data on refugees and workhopefulls. Official website states that Belgrade officialy has 1,6 mio people but 2 million is a more likely figure. You know it yourself that in countries such as ours numbers cannot reflect the situation precisely, except maybe in Vojvodina, which was less hit by refugee-wave and depopulation than the rest of Serbia. User:NeroN_BG
The number of 1,281,801 is not a population of urban Belgrade. It is a population of all urban settlements in Belgrade City District counted together, including Belgrade, Surčin, Lazarevac, Mladenovac, etc. (All settlements marked with letter "G", meaning "grad" or "gradsko naselje"). The population of Belgrade is only a population of these parts of the document where is written "Beograd-deo". So, if you calculate all numbers from "Beograd-deo" lines you will have a population of 1,119,642. Also, refugees were subject of official census (I know that because I worked for statistics in the time of census). PANONIAN (talk) 16:40, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
1,281,801 is indeed a population of urban Belgrade, which can easily be checked on the Census. If I was to choose between believing the government-approved/sponsered official data or some weird calculations conducted by a complete anonymous, I'm afraid I would pick the first option even though I don't find it accurate either (since the margin of error in Belgrade, population-wise, is much greater than in other European cities taking the circumstances and thus cannot be approached to in the same way). Anyways, please use official info; Wikipedia is about supporting official data, not our own calculations. Sure refugees are subject to official census, but only those who are registered. 100,000 refugees live in temporary shelters througout Serbia and the rest are waiting for final resolution. It is true that most of the refugees from Croatia and Kosovo (Bosnia on a smaller scale) have found their new homes in Serbia/Belgrade but many are "on hold", waiting for their status to be resolved (only about a quarter have gained SCG citizenship so far). Official number of refugees has dropped from circa 750,000 in 1999, to 600,000 in 2003 to about 483,000 in 2005, many of whom are currently expatriates. Only a minority of the displaced today holds a SCG passport, while the rest are, until the moment their status is resolved, considered as temporary citizens. Urban municipality (City) of Belgrade has a population of 1,576,124: it is divided into its urban and suburban parts, out of which 10 are urban and 7 suburban. Urban part of the municipality contains 1,281,801 and the suburban parts add up another 294,323 inhabitants to the city. However Belgrade region contains areas adjacent to the urban municipality that are officialy not subject to Census since they do not belong to neither of the 2 levels of hierarchy Belgrade's territory is arranged by; these areas add up further rise in the city's population. User:NeroN_BG
Did you just read what I wrote? Check that PDF document again. What you will read there? Do you will read there that 1,281,801 is a population of urban Belgrade. No, you will not!!!
You will read this:
"Gradska" means "Gradska naselja" and "Ostala" means "Ostala naselja". Did you noticed the word "naselja" instead of "naselje", thus that mean that there are more than one of them. It is population of all settlements marked with letter "g" (grad) in that document. "Grad" is not Belgrade but every settlement with town/city status. So, what I use here IS OFFICIAL info, but problem is that you do not know how to interpretate that info. The anonymous user posted this number first, and then I calculated that number too, and gained the same figure of 1,119,642 as he did. If you want go to Republic Statistical Office in Belgrade and buy CD with full document (It is only 200 dinars) and calculate numbers for yourself. Also, I know that Belgrade is divided into urban and sub-urban, but these numbers do not show that. Number of 1,281,801 is not a number of urban Belgrade, but a number of urban Belgrade + towns from sub-urban part of Belgrade. PANONIAN (talk) 14:41, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
Not it!!! http://www.un.org/Depts/dhl/da/kosovo/koso_sc1.htm . In south of teritory of the littel Serbia are Albanians (In border with US, English and French Sekror) in citys like Presevo, Bujanoc and Medvedja. Ther was war and the Serbian Goverment has maket a agreement for Language, schoolo and religion with Albanians (see the UN rez about the South Serbia and north Macedonia). In this articel they are not present but they must bee preseant becose ther is kulturel autonomy.-- Hipi Zhdripi 14:05, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
In wikipedia in this time (2006) is.
Not it!!! Is not the same, RS of Serbia = Rep. Serbia. No body dont in UN dont accept this. The Serbian Govermet is saying that Kosovo is part of Rep. of Serbia but the Kosovars have maked referendum wich is legetim. Argument see: http://www.srbija.sr.gov.yu/?change_lang=en A PLAN FOR THE POLITICAL SOLUTION TO THE SITUATION IN KOSOVO AND METOHIJA-- Hipi Zhdripi 02:37, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
--
Hipi Zhdripi 02:37, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
So, what you suggest that we change in Serbia article? PANONIAN (talk) 02:48, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
We must finde the global view of all this. We can represant this region unter one Law but not mixed.
Hipi Zhdripi: You still did not said what you want to change in this article. I told you that current status of Kosovo is confusing and that we cannot do much regarding this. We should wait to see what will happen with the state union of Serbia-Montenegro, what will be the results of Montenegrin referendum and what will be final status of Kosovo, and then and only then we could have good and correct articles about Serbia, Kosovo and Montenegro. Until then, we have what we have. PANONIAN (talk) 16:02, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
Only for Propaganda about Kosovo since he Wikipedia is was Open you presentin Serbia als a region. You present the Montenegro nation als Serb Nation. The Montenegro Language als Serbian language. You are destroing youu country only to make troubel in Balkan. The Kosovars is goin to drop the Serb-Russian from Serbia. The best argumet I have findit is this:
NO COMMENT Till 13 April 2006 it was Serbia dreamening and now they want to administred Kosovo in Wikipedia.
I was the user who created this map and converted the info box into a country box and not a specially designed region box. I am an American with German and Scottish ancestry and am in no way a Serbian nationalist or Albanian-hater. I was simply redesigning the pages of the two autonomous republics of Serbia and Montenegro, both of which will probably be seperate countries within the next two months. While my opinion on the question of Kosovo is just that, my private opinion, it is doubtful that Kosovo will become an independent country anytime soon, if ever. Were it to look like Kosovo were to become indepedent relatively soon, I would most likely design a map and country box for it. Until then, Kosovo should be shown as a part of Serbia, even with its levels of autonomy. Somalia doesn't even have a government to control the entire country, and it is still shown as a united country on its map. - Helmandsare 18 April 2006, 17:10 UTC
You should wait a little with posting these maps into Serbia and Montenegro articles because it is not quite clear what will be the results of Montenegrin referendum. By the established rules of this referendum there should be at least 55% of voters that support independence if that referendum is to be recognized as valid. It is not certain whether that percent of voters will vote for independence (If 54% of voters vote for independence instead of 55% the referendum will not be valid). So, just wait that things happen first, and then change the maps. PANONIAN (talk) 23:01, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, I had a pretty good idea that those would be changed back pretty quickly, and I'm cool with that. Though if Montengro does break away, all I have to do now is just go back in the history and copy and paste the new box. Oh, and from what I hear, there's some debate about that 55% for independence clause. If it gains above 50% but not 55%, Montenegro will probably still declare its independence, but its up in the air as to who will recognize it, especially the EU, which insisted on that number because its not crazy about Montenegrin independence (probably because it would be easier to deal with one country's accension to the EU rather than two). - Helmandsare 19 April 2006, 17:00 UTC
You said, "This IS NOT an article abot Yugoslav Army or about Yugoslavia, but about SERBIA". I agree with this. Whether User:Elephantus does, is a different matter. Kind regards, Asterion 15:14, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
Asterion, the problem is that Croatian government lead by hard-nationalist HDZ party constantly spread propaganda that Serbia attacked Croatia during the 90s. How can somebody now to explain to ordinary Croatian citizen that Serbia did not had its own army and that Croatian separatist government in fact was in war with Yugoslav Peoples Army, the army of the country from which they wanted to separate. PANONIAN (talk) 15:52, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
I understand, you may want to have a look at Borovo Selo raid. The article could benefit from a whole revamp. It is incredibly biased as it stands, plus there seem to be a campaign going on to remove any mention of the war crimes committed of the MUP/HDZ militias. Regards, Asterion 16:15, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
I do not have time to work on that article. I mostly work on the articles related to regions and cities in Serbia-Montenegro, and also cleaning bad faith edits from these articles. I do not like to work on the articles related to Yugoslav wars at all, because most of them (if not all) are biased and because these wars are now past. There are lot of people here on Wikipedia who are still frustrated with these wars, but I mostly like to write about Serbia as it is now in 2006. So, what I want to achieve here is that articles about political and geographical regions are not contaminated with war frustrations. The articles related to Yugoslav wars are all contaminated with these frustrations and there is no much help for them. PANONIAN (talk) 16:28, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
Well, what I am aware is that Croatian nationalists for a long time trying to put all blame for war on Serbs and to diminish their own guilt. The one who know something about political structure of Yugoslavia and command chain of the Yugoslav army would never say that "Yugoslav People's Army was under the control of the government of Serbia". That simply was not possible. Only the police was under control of the Serbian government, but not the army (even now in 2006 the army is not under control of the Serbian government). The war in Croatia in 1991 was a war between Yugoslavia (sovereign recognized country) and its separatist republic of Croatia (still not internationally recognized in that time). The JNA was army of Yugoslavia and in that time four republics were still part of that Yugoslavia: Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia-Herzegovina and Macedonia. So, if you claim that somebody attacked Croatia, then these four republics attacked it together, not Serbia only. As for your references, we can discuss all of them one by one. Please post here some of your links and quote exact sentence that prove that government of Serbia had control over everything. PANONIAN (talk) 21:16, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
Panonia but every body know that it was Serbia. The JFA i twas under the serbiand goverment they haved three votes. (Serbia+Kosovo+Vojvodina)
Actually, it were 4 votes: Serbia+Vojvodina+Kosovo+Montenegro. However, it still was a political and military structure of Yugoslavia (not of Serbia) about what we talk here. PANONIAN (talk) 23:32, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
This is you meastek. After the Milosevic destroit the parliamen in Prishtina and Novi Sad it was only 2. You are sayin that the Kosovo (judical) have maked war agains the Croatia, Serbia (see the war in South Serbia) and himself. That is absurd and dont have a sence, see in you paragraf political structur. During this time Kosovo it was not the political structur ewen a provinc it was a district of Serbia see Districts of Serbia that is wrong it is twise Kosovo. About this is to hard to finde a agument beacose the Serbian Gouverment have censur about that. -- Hipi Zhdripi 02:57, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
To make a gut articel you must see in wich time the Belgrad Parliament have taket with force the power ower Prishtinas Parliamnet (Not it!! This it was "de jur" the deth of Yugoslavia and Yug. Vol. Army, because the Federal Law is saying that the parliament is a part of Federation and have a right to "VETO". Eche parliament in Federation it was autonom with the Court and Teritorayl Army and it was prasented in Federation). After the Milosevic has taket the power ower the Teritorayl Army of Kosovo he hawe maket Ware in the name of the two parliament Belgrad and Podgurica.(Not it!! the Yug. Vol. Army it was independet from the Republics and Federation they war under the Suprem komandan of this Army, I dont know wich Admiral as in this time and wat he prasent ther Serbia, Montenegro or Yugoslavian Law because the Federation it was deth and the Law it was acceptet from UN. They are importen think wich make to understend the articel) -- Hipi Zhdripi 03:15, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
I beg this person with lowsy English skills to leave a signature following its "arguments" so that we know who we're confronting. Kosovo was more or less independent from Serbia during Communist era; Kosovo "province" could put a veto on any decision made by Belgrade/"Serbia proper", as well as Vojvodina. Kosovo's administration within SFR Yugoslavia was entirely ethnic Albanian. In fact, Albanians had a far greater impact on their development and mere existence in Kosovo than they have ever had in their own country, Albania, which is a fair explanation for the demographic explosion among Albanians in Kosovo. Kosovo was an Albanian Uthopia, especially after Tito came to power, at one point even promising unification of Albania and Kosovo within SFRY. Serbs have became a second-class citizens in their own country far before the conflicts of the '90s, only that they were stupid enough to take it for decades before Kosovo erupted in violence (targeting Serb minority, later Albanians, then again Serbs till this day). Serbian tragedy is that they believed they could live happily with their "brother nations" while everybody else was pretty much against it and worked against them; we turned a deff ear and blind eye on bad things while actually all we should have done was protecting our own people far earlier in the past. Yugoslavia should have never existed as such. Also, about the JNA issue...JNA became increasingly serbianized during the late 80s, early 90s, and was by the end of that time 80 % Serb-controlled (comparing to a 40% share in overall Yugoslav population). However Yugoslavia was a sovereign state back in 1991 unlike its seccesionist republics and JNA had an obligation to protect lacked protection; also the JNA withdrew under pressure of international community, showing how cooperative it was in preventing further violence in Former Yugo. Army of RS and RSK were not conducted from Belgrade and there is no way to fight that fact; also paramilitary organisations such as Skorpioni were guerilla fighters who in fact are to blame for many crimes JNA is blamed on. Their leaders have later governed mafia and Belgrade's underground and represented a class for itself in Serbia till 2000. User:NeroN_BG
That is not importen hier. Hier is importen the destroing of the parliament of Prishtina. And the veto right of this parliament in Federation. Secend You dont have document in wich is "Kosovo" is a part of "Serbia". You are imagen thate. You are intepretin the dokument in wich kosovo, serbia and Vojvodina has maked a federal republik called Soc. Rep Serbia. After the Milosevic destroid the parlament in Pristina with force (tanks, Mig and paramilitary force) this Republic it was deth. Till the UN force came ther and restoried the parliament wich now must diesed wat they wont do do in the future. Dont forgetit the under the prishtinas parliament it was the teritorial army of Kosovo. Yugoslavia it was the Ex-Yugoslavia and not Yugoslavia. This ex-Y didt have a mandat in UN.-- Hipi Zhdripi 21:43, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
All right, Elephantus, I changed a sentence a little, but there is still no reason to post your POV sentence or references into article. It is clear that it was part of the leadership and institutions, since for example the ministers for agriculture or tourism certainly did not exported arms to the RSK and RS. Second thing, we still should to write word "supported" instead of "participated in war", since participations is something much more than you presented here. Also, your links should not be posted here because links about much more important things are not posted and this is not place for you to heal your war frustrations. PANONIAN (talk) 00:13, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
Sombody have putit Kosovo here with out argumet. We dont have a argumet that Kosovo is part of S/M. We have tha Constitution of this countrie but we have the rez. 1244 wich is more importen for the Wikipedia and is saying that Kosovo it is a part of Yougoslavia and is prototoriat of UN. Till we dont have a clearly argument from UN, Kosovo must be out of this articel. Pleas dont make the discution with intepretation or the Law wich are not accordin to 1244. Everybodoy can do that but that is nothing for Wikipedia. -- Hipi Zhdripi 03:44, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
I have requested semi-protection for the Kosovo, Serbia and Serbia and Montenegro articles. Hipi Zhdripi is simply too much to cope with. He has started to not just removing content but vandalise articles too. Have a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_page_protection#Current_requests_for_protection if you feel like adding anything. Regards, -- Asterion 20:23, 17 April 2006 (UTC)
Edit War, sock puppet, mytology ect. Beacos of thate we need to do:
English
Panonia and Ilir must be temporaly the two administrators for Ex-Yugoslav articels in Wikipedia. The pages on Ex-Yougoslavia: Serbia, Serbia and Montenegro, Kosovo must be protcted temporarily until the staus of Kosovo is decided. All users should be able to leave their comments at the discussion page. These two administrators should now be the ones in charge to control the articles based on the UNSC Resolution 1244. This is a compromise. This has to do with project, not with sciecne. With the science you can not make compromise. With compromise, you can make a human Law. With the human Law you have chance to make science. I know that this was not planed in this project called Wikipedia. But for the sciene we must do that. With that, we are doing nothing else, just protecting Wikipedia from Edit Wars. This is the Law in Balkan: to protect the Children at War time. Im a Kosovar I dont hate anyone, the only thing that i hate is mythology in science.
Deutsch (German)
Panonia und Ilir muessen zeitweilig die beiden verantwortlichen Adminstratoren fuer Ex Jugoslawien / Artikel in Wikipedia sein. Die Seiten von Ex Jugoslawien, Serbien, Serbien und Montenegro und Kosovo muessen zeitweilig geschuetzt werden, bis der Status von Kosovo sich entschieden hat. Jeder Benutzer kann seine Arbeit auf der Diskussionsseite lassen. Die beiden Administratoren kontrollieren dies und wenn dies inhaltlich mit der Resolution 1244 zu vereinbaren ist, koennen sie entscheiden, ob es in den Artikel uebertragen werden soll. Das ist ein Kompromiss. Das hat mit dem Projekt zu tun, aber nicht mit Wissenschaft. Mit der Wissenschaft kann man keine Kompromisse machen. Mit Kompromissen kann man ein zwischenmenschliches Gesetz machen. Dieses Gesetzt hilft der Wissenschaft. Ich weiss, das so etwas nicht in diesem Wikipediaprojekt geplant war, aber fuer die Wissenschaft, im Namen der Wissenschaft, muessen wir das tun. Damit machen wir nichts, wir schuetzen nur Wikipedia vorm Bearbeitungskrieg von Seiten. Das ist das Gesetz vom Balkan: Die Kinder in Kriegszeiten zu verteidigen. Ich bin ein Kosovar und hasse niemanden. Die einzige Sache, die ich hasse, ist die Mythologie in Wissenschaft.
This is document to make a better articel
* B92-Serbian Radio Station in English 10:06 April 18 2006| Beta
BUJANOVAC -- Riza Haljimi said that Albanians should be included in the drafting of a new Serbian constitution.
“The national minority in Serbia should have certain rights, by principles proposed by the international community, because this is what is being asked to be done for Serbs in Kosovo.” the leader of the Democratic Action Party said ...
He added that decentralisation is one of the best methods for integrating the minority.
“If this happens, there will be no talks of changing borders and of having South Serbia belong to Kosovo.” Haljimi said.
He also criticised the Serbian Government for not speaking enough about the problems faced by the people living in the Presevo Valley.
09:49 April 14 2006| Beta BELGRADE -- Rasim Ljajic met with Prime Minister Vojislav Kostunica yesterday to discuss his recent resignation.
Earlier this week, Ljajic, who is the president of the National Council for Hague Cooperation and Serbia-Montenegro Human and Minority Rights Minister, resigned from his position as president of the South Serbia Coordination Centre. The decision was made after the Serbian Government decided to intervene in Novi Pazar and disband the municipal government...
Sorry but in this Serbian democratic radio ar talkin about two cuntries. Now I don understandent is Kosovo a part of Serbia?
I believe that the war crimes that Serbia committed or supported are so widespread that make war crimes an integral point of the simpliest description of Serbia. I believe that for the next few decades, the reference to war crimes should be part of any article on Serbia. This will have three purposes:
-- Aleksandar Šušnjar 17:25, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
Sorry but I find ridiculous what you are saying. It is common knowledge that Serbia commited crimes in croatia, just go read the transcripts at the Hague Tribunal. I think the crimes that Serbian expansionist nationalism brought in Kosovo since 1912, in Bosnia and Croatia since 1918 are enormous and they were conducted on your name and on the name of all Serbs. They were not the personal interest of Rankovic or Milosevic, they were on the interest of all Serbs, as Serb nationalists perceived it. Of course I am ashamed of any criminal act that Albanians committed against Serbs either in revenge or out of nationaisist feelings. I am ashamed of the Albanian youth crowds burning Serbian Churches in March 2004. I consider those churches a valuable heritage of my country, Kosovo, that need to be protected. What you are saying about Albanians having crossed from Albania, you should know that that is total BS. There are no such Albanians. I was born and raised in Kosovo and I know only one old man who came from Albania during WWII as a teacher (there are exactly 180 of those teachers who were brought by the Italians to open schools in Albanian). That is total propaganda. Ever since Serbs invaded Kosovo in 1912, they have been trying to ethnically cleanse it of its Albanian population. When they failed to do it, after the WWII, they came up with the strangest theory ever, that Albanians actually came from Albania ivited by Tito. That is funny and tragic. Dardanv
You mention Serb expansionism in Kosovo, Croatia and Bosnia. That is possibly popular propaganda, but try to find any official attempts at any expansionism:
-- Aleksandar Šušnjar 21:02, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
I could not not answer you. If you believe these things you are saying, then I feel endulged to give you an information therapy. My diagnosis for you is 'serb nationalistic propaganda infected. I will address your points one by one:
1. Serbia had expanssionist goals. The causes for it are the spread of nationalism in the XIXth century. Have you read 'Nacertanije' from Garasanin? You should read it, if you haven't as that is the recipe for Serb expansionism and you can see where Milosevic's ideas came from. Have you not heard of Ilija Garasanin and his plan "The expulsion of Albanians"? Please google and find them and read them both. I could give you more, but these will suffice for now. I will give you a link which gives you access to all these documents, you will love them, but you shouldn't http://www.elsie.de/pdf/B2002GatheringClouds.pdf Once your infection is over, you will feel sorry. dardanv
2. When I heard for the first time the the theory of Albanians crossing over from Albania to populate Kosovo, I laughed. It was a very good Serbian friend of mine who told me. But ever since then I have heard it some 10 times more and another Serbian friend of mine told me that you even learn that in schools. I can guarantee you that that is total bullshit. It has nothing to do with reality. There is a town in Albania (Fier) that half of the population are Kosovars, who were expelled to Turkey and were not let to go back, then King Zog accepted them in Albania. But the number of Albanians coming from Albania to Kosovo after WWII should be insiginifcant, as I as a citizen of Kosovo know not of them. dardanv
3. Yes Serbia invaded Kosovo, which was internationally part of the Ottoman Empire. The people of Kosovo were not asked whether they wanted to be part of Serbia. Instead they were massacred, expulsed by the Serbian Army and they fought against them. Oh Yes, Kosovo was part of the Nemanjic territory in medieval times, but remind you, Nations didn't exist at that time. Stephan Dushan called himself "King of Serbs, Albanians and Wallahians." We don't know the composition of the population then, so we can only speculate. But Let me remind you that Kosovo was part of the Kingdom of Bulgaria for a far longer period then that of the Nemanjic dinasty. Kosovo was part of the Roman Empire for quite some time to, and Kosovo was for a very long time the Kingdom of Dardania. Let's not forget that Kosovo was part of the Ottoman Empire for 500 years, and they are not claiming it. The most important element is that when Kosovo was invaded by Serbia, the army was not considred a home army by the people, it was considered a foregn army in the same manner as it was considered 87 years later. We the people of Kosovo, fought against it as an ivading foreign army. So if Turkey ivades Kosovo tomorrow, you will say that it is not invasion because Kosovo was part of the Ottoman Empire for 500 years? What about Bulgarians? dardanv
4. Ethnic cleansing! Hmmmm, do you know about the agreement between Serbia and Turkey to send 'Turks' to Turkey before the WWII? Do you know how many Albanians went to Turkey under oppression by the Serbian army? Read Garasanin please! The agreement was put again in practice by Rankovic. Hundreds of thousands of Albanians were forced to leave to Turkey. Albanian sources claim that some 350,000 Albanians were killed by Serb forces in Kosovo since 1912. Hard to prove, but I rad the list of people killed in the village of Tuxhec (where former PM Kosumi comes from) 124 people were killed in this village alone. There are a few thousand villages in Kosovo. The only time when ethnic cleansing against Serbs has occurred is during the WWII and after 1999, when Albanians revenged. I don't agree with revenge, I think revenge does not erase the previous crime, it just creates one more. However, let me also inform you about the Agrarian Reform. You must have heard of the "Plan for Colonization of Kosovo and Metohija". Do you know how much land was taken away from Albanians and given to Serbian colons, Yes COLONS, the Serbian Government called them colons! dardanv
5. Hitler failed to kill all Jews, but his goal was to do so! And he tried it! The goal of Serb nationalists has always to kill, expel 51 percent of the people from Kosovo in order to achieve a Serb majority. Is anyone talking about Nis anymore? No! Because it was ethnically cleansed in 1878 and now it is the decendants of colons from Serbia and Montenegro living there. Serbia tried to do that continuously in Kosovo but the situation had changed and the international community would not allow anymore the same means to be used as in Eastern Kosovo, today Southern Serbia. This is the dose of antibiotics for now. I am sorry to tell you that your infection is quite dangerous it may harm you and others around you. It must be treated immediately!!!! It is more dangerous then the bird flu! Your infection has caused the death of some 200,000 people in former Yugoslavia since 1990, it has lead to the economic collapse of the region, it has delayed EU integration for some 20 years and it has destroyed the reputation of the region for some 50 years. Dardanvv
http://www.elsie.de/pdf/B2002GatheringClouds.pdf
Truth hurts, sometimes. But it is better to face it than hide behind lies in a cawordly manner. Be strong and tough and accept the truth and you will feel better. The sooner Serbs do this, the better it will be for them and for and for others aroudn them. Be bald and say: "Yes, my govevernment and the elite of my people have continuously wanted to expand Serbia to the disadvantage of other peoples in the region, who fell victims of my country's expanssionism. I am sorry for all the victims that this expanssionism has caused!" This is what I would respect deeply. dardanv
For Dardanv: please do not be ridiculous. First see yourself and then speak about Serbian nationalists. Your "bad faith" edits in this article speak much about you. PANONIAN (talk) 11:39, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
"it is important to include a reference to war crimes and genocide in the introductory part of the article on Serbia because it is an integral part of the Serb national conscience"
You just insulted all Serbs including me with this statement. I have nothing to talk with people like you. Better say something about crimes of the members of your own nation against Serbs. PANONIAN (talk) 16:40, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
Reference to war crimes (both Serb and Albanian ones) do not belong to Serbia article but to Kosovo war article. Since this is not article about Kosovo war but about Serbia we do not have reason to post that here. PANONIAN (talk) 21:43, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
We can argue a lot who is responsible for 1999 war. In 1993/1994 (if I remember correctly), Milan Panić was a candidate for the president, if Albanians voted to support him, he would defeat Milošević and Serbia would became democratic. But Albanian leaders said that Albanians should not vote on this election, thus they did not vote, Milan Panić lost, and Milošević stayed in power. It is Albanian leaders who choosen that Milošević should stay in power (they admited that latter), and they choose this because they thought that only with Milošević on power they can to provoke NATO intervention (and they were right). So, do not try to tell me who is responsible for war. PANONIAN (talk) 22:25, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
Peace, Dardanv
I added the proper copyright information to the Coat of Arms. The arms were rendered by our society, we since short have a website (see image information). Our society did most of the designs (if a city did not have an arms since medieval times) and did all of the rendering of these images. The images can be used freely provided that no one makes any changes to them. We do however wish that we are being recognised for our work and ask people to see & verify that all images of the cities in Serbia get a link back to use with a notice that the design has been done by us.
Our site: Serbian Heraldic Society White Eagle/Beli Orao Gallery of arms: Gallery of Coat of Arms
We will in the near future expand our gallery and provide background information of the different designs. The information may be used on Wikipedia be it provided that we are being credited.
Thank you. SGS 13:06, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
Can this article be unlocked even for day or two? I would like to make some changes in gallery. -- Pockey 17:22, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
It is only semi-protected to avoid sockpuppet/unsigned IP vandalism. You should be able to edit it as it stands. --
Asterion
talk to me
17:55, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
Copy of the comments left by Dardan V. on my talk page about his recent edit war on this article:
This explains everything. This user and others previously threatened to disrupt any Serbia-related article if any non-Albanian wikipedian had anything to do with the
Kosovo article (see talk page archives). I would appreciate any advice on how to take effective action against this sort of behaviour. This user is currently blocked for second time for breaking the 3RR rules. --
Asterion
talk to me
18:22, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I remember when they said that they will disrupt Serbia-related articles and it is what is happening now. PANONIAN (talk) 22:07, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
If this does not stop somehow, I will ask for a
Wikipedia:Request for Comment --
Asterion
talk to me
22:20, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
Can samboy stopt this user who is puting his nois only to make troub in the Albanias and Serb articels. User:Asterion. Please PANONIA and Dardanv or who you are stop maken war and finde a soulution. Don let that souch cand of user make yu crasy. The articel of Serbia and Kosovo they are gonin to have the same karakter. If Serbia articel is going to be a geograficel articel that is going to be a Kosovo articel. But PANONIA it has no seans if you dont put a map in Kosovo articel and you let this mape hier. I think for the momet you and Ilir must finde a soulution. Don forgetit the only way ist to finde a global soulution about this problem and to localise the user als User:Asterion. Don let that this use put a gas in fire.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Hipi Zhdripi ( talk • contribs)
I have a great idea how to deal with it! Just stop vandalizing the Albanian-related articles (Kosovo-included) and the problem will be over. How about that? Dardanv —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dardanv ( talk • contribs)
The only way is to work in the global soulution and to lokalised the problem makers -- like me (some times) Hipi Zhdripi
This is rediculous. This article has been unlocked for 10 hours, and an annonymous user has already vandalized it. Хајдук Еру ( Talk || Contributions) 05:07, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
First of all Serbia waged war over croatia and not letting Croatia have back their land for about 86 years. Serbs have taken Croatian riches, stole their land and killed inocent croatian people during the 1990's war. Made Croatia look like terriosit, Facists even though serbia had there own facists regime. If it wasn't for King Tomislav of croatia serbia would have been conqured by the bulgarian empire if Croatia didn't Fight and win for Serbia. -- Marbus2 5 16:10, 5 May 2006 (UTC)
This is exactly the problem with Croats: Too much anti-Serb media and not enough historical accuracy in their reports.
First of all, the Serbs rebelled in Serb land, I didn't hear of any Serbs rebelling in Zagreb, or other mostly Croatian regions. Yes, innocent people were killed, but Marbus forgot to mention the word on both sides, I'm refering, of course, to the Gospic massacre, Dalmatian kristallnacht and Operation Storm.
And who can forget that famous "Danke Deutschland" song or maybe the video of Branimir Glavaš openly expressing his love of fascism by telling the freed Croatian POW's: "Slobodno recite da ste ustaše, i jeste!" (feel free to say that you are the Ustashe, because you are!), why would anyone think that the government was fascist. Oh, and the flags of the Nazi pupped state of the NDH does "not" look like the one that Croatia has now.
And last, but not least, after WWII, there was no apology for the holocaust comitted by Croats. The Serbs, thrilled of the idea of brotherhood and unity, had forgiven their brothers, the Croats, for all the attrocities, and the Croats repaid them by putting the chessboard symbol on their flag, a symbol of the Ustashe, which is just like if the Germans put the swastika on their flag in the 1990s. How do you think the world would react if that happened?
And I'm supposed to listen to storied that the Croats fought for Serbia? Don't make me laugh, or maybe I should cry that there are still people in this 21st century, so poorly educated and brainwashed by the media, and even trying to contribute to a free encyclopaedia. For shame. -- serbiana - talk 01:30, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
They did fight for Serbia but back then it wasnt called Serbia it was called Rugska so considering Croatia had problems with Bulgeria at the time King Tomislav with all his kindness decided to help the small countrie of Rugska. The only reason it became Serbia is because of the Ottaman invashion of Rugska around the early fourteen centuary. The country of Rugska decided to become the Ottaman Servant's. So then the country of Rugska was changed to Servia at fist and then to Serbia. So in fact Serbia means Turkish slaves or servants. By the way the Croatian Gerb isnt Facist its been used by Croatian kings since the early 11th centuary when the Croatian king diceded to have a chess match with the King of Bulgeria to dertmin Croatia freedom and in result the Croatian king won. Serbia also had a facist regime the Chetnicks lead by Drago Meholovich. -- Marbus2 5 04:37, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
A few questions before I respond: What is Gerb? What is Bulgeria? What is determin? What is Drago Meholovich? I'd like to understand exactly what you're saying before I show just how wrong you are. -- serbiana - talk 05:59, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
The Gerb is the chess board which is in the middle of the Croatian flag. Secondly Bulgeria is a country. Thirdly Drago Meholovich was the leader of the Facists chetniks army who were loyal to the Kingdom of Yugoslavia. -- Marbus2 5 07:10, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
Gerb means nothing in English. You're thinking about Coat of Arms. "Grb" is Coat of Arms in Serbian and Croatian. Bulgeria means nothing in English, you're thinking about Bulgaria. Drago Mehlovich means nothing in English or any other language, it's Draza Mihajlovic, or simply Draza. This is the English Wikipedia. How come a lot of your words mean nothing in English? -- serbiana - talk 20:13, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
The Serbs? hmmmm Liberete Croatia? This is exactly the problem with Croats (Sllovens, Muslims, Makedonians, Albanians, Montenegrins, Bugariens ect): Too much anti-Serb media and not enough historical accuracy in their reports. Way?
First of all, the Serbs rebelled in Serb land, I didn't hear of any Serbs rebelling in Zagreb, or other mostly Croatian regions.
Serbian Jogurt Revulution before the Yugoslavien War in
Huuu , all this countries are Serbs?
Its not "way" its "why". Secondly, a country cannot be a Serb, it just doesn't make sense. "this countries" doesn't make sense, it's "these countries". When you learn how to communicate in a proper way I will show you just how wrong you are. Untill then, my efforts won't be fully appreciated simply because you won't understand everything. -- serbiana - talk 20:16, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
Hahaha I just can't quit laughing // Servia
And should be deleted. -- Hurricane Angel 01:44, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
Please till we don t know wat is going to be with Kosovo, let the mape in this section. If Kosovo is going to be "de facto" and "de juro" part of SM then we are going to chance that.-- Hevnonen 18:27, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
OK, I've had enough of reverting this page after vandalism acts of clearly separatist ideology followers. According to the CIA factbook, Kosovo, even though administered by the UN, is a part of Serbia, and there is a map that also shows that. "Administrative divisions: 2 nominally autonomous provinces (both in the republic of Serbia); Kosovo (temporarily under UN administration, per UN Security Council Resolution 1244) and Vojvodina." End of discussion. -- serbiana - talk 19:30, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
Not to mention the country of Montenargo will get their independance soon and if Serbia refuse it will be war again. Serbia can't afford another war. Its bad enough there consisered as the poorest country in Eroupe, so if the serbs want war it will be a big blow to the Serbian econemy. Not to mention the already aid that has been cut off to Serbia by the EU and the USA for not giving war criminal Radco Mladic. -- Marbus2 5 12:35, 9 May 2006 (UTC)
nb: Moldova is the poorest country in Europe
This article is about Serbia and not for Yugoslavia, Kosovo is not a part of Serbia-- Hevnonen 13:50, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
Kosovo is still part of Serbia under UN administration. We should wait the end of negotiations in Wiena. -- Pockey 16:16, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
Can someone change the map to indicate that Montenegro and Serbia are no longer a political entity? Politis 15:53, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
In that case we must wait until the separation is official and, especially, that Montenegro becomes a full member of the UN in its own right. Politis 19:26, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
Is Voivodina going to break away from Serbia. My thinkin is that it has a Hungarian majority that would prefer to join the EU through Hungary. How did a country that was considered a heroic WWII ally, end up with no one wanting to have anything to do with it. Even the Serbs are trying to get out. Politis 15:57, 23 May 2006 (UTC)
Since Serbia and Montenegro will soon be dissolved, does this mean that Serbia now becomes an entirely new state, and not simply a successor to the union?
Osli73, if you mention Slovenia and Croatia: please note that The Opinions of the Badinter Arbitration Committee is that SFRY was dissolved (against the will of SR Serbia, back than, as we know). This opinion was also adopted by the United Nations; see note on former Yugoslav republics on List of UN member states. There is no single successor to the SFRY (I'm not stating anything about successor of SCG). -- romanm ( talk) 17:54, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for the info romanm. As Serbia and CG continued to use the Yugoslavia name and I never heard of them being recognized by other states or the UN following the dissolution of the old Yugoslavia, I always assumed that it was the successor state to the old Yugoslavia. Osli73 18:42, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
In World War I, Serbia had 1,264,000 casualties — 28% of its population, which also represented 58% of its male population. I would like to see some citation regarding these numbers. All what I found was that Serbia had 45.000 military casualities. Total human loss in WW I was around 9 million.-- 193.81.246.92 09:31, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Where's the national motto in the article? Paulus Caesar 01:01, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Got it filled out and raring to go at User:Estavisti/Serbia, for as soon as we become independent. Any day now...-- estavisti 03:31, 27 May 2006 (UTC) Didn't realise someone had beaten me to it :( -- estavisti 03:34, 27 May 2006 (UTC)