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I was just wondering if there's a particular reason why the 63rd Street Tunnel isn't included under "East River Crossings." I understand the 63rd Street Line is included elsewhere, but I'd think the tunnel itself belongs with the crossings. I would have just changed it, but I wanted to see first if there was a reason I just wasn't thinking of.
Mjj237 16:08, 15 September 2006 (UTC)reply
Not sure what you mean. The
63rd Street Tunnel article clearly shows that it is an East River crossing, and it is categorized as such.
Marc Shepherd 16:19, 15 September 2006 (UTC)reply
Route numbers
These numbers were used during construction. --
NE2 19:38, 15 April 2007 (UTC)reply
101, 6th Avenue and 53rd Street via Cranberry Street to Jay Street between Nassau and Concord Streets
[1]
102, 6th Avenue and Greenwich Avenue via Eighth Avenue to 64th Street (north of there had already been approved to 193rd Street, as an extension of the BMT Broadway Line
[2])
102, 8th Avenue and 53rd Street to Queens
103, Houston Street, presumably to Jay Street between Nassau and Concord Streets
From the lede: "In addition, the BMT's M, N, Q and R now run partly on IND trackage." The M and R are obvious to me, but unless I am missing something, the N doesn't appear to run on any IND trackage, and I'm pretty sure the Q doesn't either. Regardless, this statement needs elaboration, I think. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?
Tduk (
talk) 05:17, 30 January 2023 (UTC)reply
I did a history search and came up with this edit: Revision as of 01:37, 6 June 2017 SkipperRipper(Rush hours some N service is on IND.), I'll ping them.
Tduk (
talk) 05:39, 30 January 2023 (UTC)reply
Why are we classifying it as IND? I saw that it was originally planned as part of that, but was it ever constructed when IND still existed? I don't think it ever had trains on it before the unification, did it? I think that we should explain all of these answers in the article if we can.
Tduk (
talk) 19:48, 31 January 2023 (UTC)reply
After discussing/researching offline, any objection to changing the lede paragraphs to reflect the difference between the original IND trackage, and the new trackage built under the IND chaining?
Tduk (
talk) 21:18, 31 January 2023 (UTC)reply
It is all originally IND. Proposed almost 100 years ago. Some sections were built in the 1970s, well after unification. The IND does still exist, but as about half of the NYC Subway’s “B Division”. See
Independent Subway System for more details on the IND. —
SkipperRipper (
talk) 04:11, 1 February 2023 (UTC)reply
I just linked you back you to the main article. Oops, sorry I wasn’t paying attention, I have had a rough go of things lately. I think changing the paragraph doesn’t bring anything extra to the article. But, maybe the specitivity that some BMT routes use IND trackage in Queens and Manhattan, and some IND routes use (and have recaptured) BMT trackage in Brooklyn can be worked in? —
SkipperRipper (
talk) 04:23, 1 February 2023 (UTC)reply
I think it's worth distinguishing between trackage that was build pre-unification vs. trackage building using IND chaining/signaling, as the wording currently in the article implies, at least to me, that the N/Q is running on pre-unification trackage. This is at least partly because the article says the ISS was a rapid transit rail system in New York City, implying that any trackage mentioned was built while the ISS was an actual entity. If I got confused, I'm not likely to be the only one. This is a very interesting distinction that I don't think I've seen explored anywhere in any article here.
Tduk (
talk) 17:02, 1 February 2023 (UTC)reply
I just did a little digging in the IND article and found just TWO sentences for the SAS under “Proposed expansion” and “Extensions after 1940”. I think this should be expounded upon (like a paragraph or two) somewhere new (“New Lines”?) in the article (and remove it from “Extensions”) as the SAS is not an extension (for exanple) like the (E) to Jamaica Center is. —
SkipperRipper (
talk) 04:33, 2 February 2023 (UTC)reply
Sorry if I've been confusing. Nowhere in the first paragraphs is it implied that IND trackage does not mean "trackage made by the IND", which _is_ said in the lede to no longer exist. Without a clear definition of what is meant by the term "IND trackage", it can be misleading. Does that make any sense?
Tduk (
talk) 19:04, 2 February 2023 (UTC)reply