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I've "fact"-tagged the statement that "the origins of the term are unknown". We shouldn't confuse our state of knowledge as Wikipedia editors with the state of knowledge of scholarship. That sentence, as it stands, implies that scholars have looked into the matter by browsing through the historical archives and come up empty-handed. If that's the case, fine, and it should be referenced. If, however, the sentence only means to say that a few Wikipedia editors have looked into the matter by surfing the web for an hour and have come up empty-handed, it is seriously misleading. Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:36, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
With all due respect and in all humility, the top comment can (i.e. possibly under certain conditions) be seen as totally superfluous in terms of Wikipedia editing because the duration of net surfing has little to do with it. An editor may be an expert in this field with a long standing and professional experience; but his/her conclusions and assesment will be considered POV by wiki standards if the statement cannot be (reasonably?) sourced. That seems like a sound wiki choice and I agree with it. Of course, ill disposed editors can 'suffocate' an article with an overkill of 'sources required'. However, again, no problem, that is the nature of wikipedia and that is why it is not such a reliable tool. It is what it is. Politis 13:03, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
The term Aegean Macedonia is not a nationalist Macedonian Slav term. It is the name for that area of Macedonia. It is the name of the area in Macedonian. It has been used by western sources to describe the area as well here is an example [1] where Canadian Macedonian Steve Stavro is said to have been born in Aegean Macedonia.
As you can see this term is not a nationalist term. It is used by western sources. Alexander the great1 19:53, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
That is an article by a sports writer, he writes the information he is given. But please send all other the examples you have since I am compiling a catalogue of 'irredentist' language and tracking down the origin of such comments. Thank you very much. Anyway, with that logic, the term 'Western Bulgaria' or 'Whole Bulgaria' to refer to FY/RoM is also not a nationalist term. Politis 15:05, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
Please provide evidence regarding the presumed appelation 'Aegean Macedonia' since the Treaty of Stephano, up to 1944 or 1945. No Bulgarian, Greek, Engish or French source texts I have seen use that expression. If no evidence is provided, then we must remove that reference until such evidence is provided. Regarding the Bulgarian reference, please can you translate it.
San Stephano Treaty does not even include the terms 'Aegean' or 'Macedonia' [2] Politis 16:16, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
I think there is an overkill with the whole irrednetism claim about Macedonians. While certainly worth mentioning from a historical perspective, this article in particlular is filled with these claims.
This is just an outdated hangover from 1950s communist era, held onto by some because they lack any real arguements Hxseek 03:30, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
You have a good point; the problem is that if it is just about the 'term', then the article can be just one paragraph. In fact, it was originally created as a form of disambiguation with most of the material provided by Politis (yours truly) and accepted by the then editors. Of course things move on. Politis 12:25, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
I agree that some editing may be required. Even though 'Aegean Macedonia' is a neologism, it strictly refers to the Greek province of Macedonia - hence the explanatory box in the main article. Regarding 'coastal', Plato used the metaphor, "Like frogs around a pond, we [the Greeks] have settled down upon the shores of the Aegean". Politis 13:06, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
The inclusion of Mala Prespa and Golo Bardo in Aegean Macedonia must be a rare exeption. Those people in Skopje who use such territorial interpretations (it is not official policy to do so) clearly distinguish between the Macedonians in Albania, Bulgaria, Greece and former Yugoslavia. Certainly the Greeks do not include it and neither do Slav Macedonians who originate from Greek Macedonia. Even under Tito, AM = Greek province of Macedonia. Regarding Plato, I am not aware of it being original research to quote him with regard to the term Aegean and what it means to the Greeks. Albion and Blighty are historical terms to include a profile; here we are using the profile for Greek Macedonia, not of Greece. Politis 13:35, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
Look at the map Macedonia (region). The article and maps were agreed upon by editors from many parts of Europe and south east Europe and it featured as a Today's Article in Wikipedia; AM = Greek Macedonia. For instance, those who used the term since the 1950s and the Aegean Macedonians / Slav Macedonians who published 'Makedonska Iskra' in Australia at the time were from Greek Macedonia, not from Albania. One reason for excluding Albania by Tito was due to their common political ideology at the time. Politis 14:02, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
As a compromise, we could simply include some of the details from the profile. Saddly, I have no idea how to create or edit such boxes. Perhaps someone can help out. Politis 14:11, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
I think the Greek one since this article is strictly about AM; the United Macedonia includes all the others and is a different article. Politis 14:29, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
The following passage from the article displays some confusion about sources:
Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:27, 7 October 2007 (UTC)
BalkanFever, can you provide a number of sources from FY/ROM where 'Aegean Macedonia' is NOT used in an irredentist manner? Also, please provide irredentist sources. Politis ( talk) 12:43, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
From Macedonia Region in Britannica Online [3]
"...The ensuing treaty in 1913 assigned the southern half, or “Aegean Macedonia,” to Greece and most of the northern half (“Vardar Macedonia”) to Serbia; a much smaller portion, “Pirin Macedonia,” went to Bulgaria..." Alex Makedon ( talk) 23:05, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
I'd suggest to clear this article from the pollitical millitant propaganda tones and POV's like the continous "irredentistic" labels attached every time the historical term Aegean Macedonia is used. Alex Makedon ( talk) 14:35, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
I suggest FYROM irredentists stop referring to the province of Macedonia as "Aegean Macedonia". Not your country or history Alex.... exactly why there is a name dispute. -- Crossthets ( talk) 08:36, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
tFYROM and all the negotiation process is a sign of good will and understanding Republic of Macedonia is showing by choice, otherwise wtf cares how "Greeks" feel about the name of their neighbouring country, they can feel whatever they like. Alex Makedon ( talk) 00:37, 16 November 2008 (UTC)
This is a Greek article of a Greek province. The first reference is to Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia. The subsequent ones are Republic of Macedonia. They will probably also have to be changed. Editors of all persuations have already gone over this. Politis ( talk) 13:07, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
We shouldn't probably be doing this ("original research" and all that jazz), but since the article is currently claiming the term was only invented in the 1940s, I've been searching a bit... :
The following are hits on Google books showing usage of the term significantly before 1945:
It is true that attestations become significantly more frequent after c.1945 in the context of the Greek Civil War, and there are also a few attestations were outside (Western) sources denounce the term as associated with Titoist territorial claims, but there are also quite numerous examples immediately after 1945 where the term is apparently used by outside western sources with no apparent political overtones whatsoever, as if already a completely established term.
Now, I'm not asking that all of this should be written into the article. What I'm asking is that we shouldn't be doing these kinds of things either way. Either a reliable source tells us when and how the term was introduced, or tells us explicitly that scholars have tried to find out and still don't know; or we have no business talking about the issue.
Fut.Perf. ☼ 19:02, 29 November 2008 (UTC)
The use of the word "irredentist" is nothing more than Greek POV pushing! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 38.112.96.194 ( talk) 15:38, 5 August 2009 (UTC)
From Macedonia (Greece): "Since World War II, Greek Macedonia is sometimes called Aegean Macedonia, a term introduced by Tito in 1945 to lay claim on Greek Macedonia and in the build up to the Greek civil war."
Aegean Macedonia is a term used for irredentist purposes and has limited (if not zero) use among native english speakers.
I propose deletion of this article, cleanup of the useful parts and expand a relevant section in Macedonia (Greece). - Thomas —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.66.33.148 ( talk) 00:11, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
The term is apparently also used by Bulgarians, see the Bulgarian interwiki of Macedonia (Greece) that points to bg:Егейска Македония. Interesting, the Serbian interwiki also points to sr:Егејска Македонија, but not the Serbocroatian one. Andreas (T) 17:14, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
As expected this article was filled with strong nationalist POVs, that were either unsourced or badly sourced, original research on origins of the term based merely by using the earliest date written under Google Book results, and terribly written with terrible sourcing style and unable to verify - several sources have no page numbers at all. I cut out a lot of the POV, but this article still is terribly written and with strong POV tendencies in an accusatory manner pointing at Bulgarians and Slavic Macedonians essentially as people to be held responsible for the existence of the name "Aegean Macedonia".-- R-41 ( talk) 22:15, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
The material needs a total re-write by editors who do not have an axe to grind on the whole "Macedonia" name issue. I am a non-Balkan person who is interested in Balkan history, suggest that this article should be merged as a section on the Macedonia (region) article.-- R-41 ( talk) 22:15, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
Well meaning question: Is User:Pozeetronic a sock puppet? He/she came out of nowhere but in full possession of how to challenge an article and did so without engaging in the discussion page. Politis ( talk)
I'm unclear why people keep reinserting the reference I removed to Loring Danforth's book in the first paragraph. A quick look at the book reveals that the reference has been selectively edited and the quotes are taken out of context to misrepresent the book. thanks. 73.134.243.84 ( talk) 15:55, 9 April 2020 (UTC)
Great updated the reference to the Koliopoulos book. problem solved. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.18.32.70 ( talk) 22:02, 13 April 2020 (UTC)