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Text and/or other creative content from this version of Non-stop flight was copied or moved into Longest flights with this edit on 04:16, 17 December 2016. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
Inaugurated on December 2, 2015. 16 hours 55 minutes.
213.65.173.167 ( talk) 11:15, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
May want to be careful with that one. Hearing that Air India has revised the flight path. Instead of going north and then west, the flight is now rerouted to head east to take advantage of the jet stream. Apparently, this route is more fuel efficient, not to mention quicker, while covering the biggest distance. 199.198.223.104 ( talk) 17:44, 4 November 2016 (UTC)
Hi, For the past months, several users repeatedly added AI 173 DEL-SFO, with a distance that was much longer than the orthodromic distance. Yesterday, @ Anshabhi: added again this flight with a distance of 15,142 km, quoting an article that explains that this flight uses a new route longer than the previous one. I revereted this, explaining that we list flights according to their orthodromic (most direct) distance. He/she did revert this again, and left the following message to my talk page:
Sorry, but I don't really think that orthodromic distance was anywhere in question before AI 173. The only thing that matters is the distance that the flight travels, and not the direct distance between 2 cities. Several examples:
1. In record flights, PIA flight should also not be there, as the direct distance was much smaller than 21000 km.
2. For QF-8 the direct distance is 8,024 miles but in the list, it's listed as 8,578 miles which is the route that it takes.
3. Similarly, for all the flights the distance is slightly more than perpendicular distance, but the actual distance that flight takes is considered. In cases of other flights, this is near the perpendicular distance but in case of AI 173, the actual distance is much more (over 15,100 KM or 2400 KM more than direct distance).
(Sorry for sounding a bit rude) but the word orthodromic was not in the article before yesterday, and it should not be there now either.
Therefore, I have reverted your edit. Thanks!
Here was my reply:
Hi Anshabhi
1 There is no PIA flight in the top-30 list
2 QF8 orthodromic distance is 8578 miles (with a link to GCMap that the quotation template won't let me use...)
3 There is no way to determine the exact real distance of a flight, as the flight path changes every day depending on the weather/wind. All flights are currently listed according to their orthodromic distance, I was just expliciting that.
Please acknowledge those facts so that your changes can be reverted. Don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions.
Does anyone object this? Slasher-fun ( talk) 09:30, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
But in this case, the flight in flying in opposite direction of great circle route. The great circle route flies over Atlantic, and this one flies over Pacific in reality. This route is probably an exception to what Marc Lacoste says, as using Great circle route will give totally different calculations than the route that it is actually taking. A photo to explain my point: [1] The flight used to take Great Circle route till 13 October 2016. In that case, talking about Great circle route would be sensible. But since 15 October 2016, its flying absolutely opposite to it. The value that I have quoted through a flightradar24 is the distance, if it flies directly over Pacific, which it is doing currently. While this is surely not the exact distance, but it represents the closest posssible value to average distance. Anshabhi ( talk) 11:56, 19 October 2016 (UTC) flightradar24 article, which can be found here: [2] Anshabhi ( talk) 11:58, 19 October 2016 (UTC) The PIA flight I am talking about, is from record flights " On 9 November 2005 a Pakistan International Airlines Boeing 777-200LR, dubbed the Worldliner, completed the world's longest non-stop passenger flight. It traveled 21,602 kilometres (11,664 nmi) eastward, from Hong Kong to London, in roughly 22 h 22 min, as opposed to a normal westward routing for that sector, which is much shorter at 9,647 kilometres (5,209 nmi).[3" I sincerely apologize for QF-8 point. Anshabhi ( talk) 12:12, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
Here however, we can be sure that it will always fly over Pacific Ocean, as Air India has advertised it as a round the world flight, departing over Pacific and returning over Atlantic. The orthodermic route is only slightly over Atlantic, but that's how everyone is says it! The Air India advertisement: [3] Anshabhi ( talk) 12:46, 19 October 2016 (UTC) This same advertisement was carried on front page of all major newspapers in India by Air India on 15 October 2016. Anshabhi ( talk) 12:51, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
Why do you think Air India is only using it for advertising purpose? There's a reduction of 2 hours in flying time as well. This translates into saving of almost 14,000 liters of ATF for Air India. You can always track it on either flightradar24 or flightaware. Today's flight was even longer than yesterday! Anshabhi ( talk) 13:23, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
Errr, I am sorry!😉 Anshabhi ( talk) 16:14, 19 October 2016 (UTC)
Obviously orthodromic, I don't know how can even remotely advocate anything else. It's the only figure that is a) always the same for each flight and b) comparable to every other flight on the list. Plus, the actual distance flown has no meaning at all in (commercial) aviation. Flight hours and number of cycles matter in operations, orthodromic distance matters economically (RPK/RPM) and scheduled block time matter contractually (passenger-wise). It isn't even possible to accurately log the actual distance flown. That Air India flight in the list is ridiculous. And, on a lighter note, which mileage is Air India's "Flying Returns" going to credit for this flight's passengers? ;-) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.204.153.223 ( talk) 20:22, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
Alright then! Please edit the article, in the way you feel it would be most appropriate. My suggestion is that, for now AI 173 is the longest flight. Anshabhi ( talk) 08:22, 21 October 2016 (UTC) Or probably, I am wrong. I understand that the table is according to Great Circle Distance. I am pulling out of this discussion now! Thank you everyone for your time. And sorry for wasting for your time! 😏👋 Bye! Anshabhi ( talk) 08:50, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
Hi, I think all of us agree that it's justified to mention AI 173 under "Current" column.. Right?
Anshabhi ( talk) 12:41, 27 October 2016 (UTC)
Great circle distance is purely a theoretical measure and should not be taken as a yardstick for longest flight "length". I agree that it does not change between two airports but please bear in mind that AI 173 *has* covered a much longer distance. Also, I don't agree with certain users saying that in commercial aviation the actual distance flown has no meaning at all. Please elaborate on your statement; can you please quote some reliable sources that categorically mention that it does not matter? By reliable sources, I mean agencies or individuals related to civil aviation and recognized worldwide. Opinions of Wikipedia users (like you and me) don't count. Also, if you think that actual length does not matter, then can we also measure several other "world records" by their theoretical and not actual values? For example, let us take the example mentioned here - http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/world-records/29556-longest-motorcycle. It can clearly be seen that the theoretical length of the motorcycle is much smaller than 26.29 metres but the owner managed to increase the length by adding some temporary structure. Guinness acknowledged the record, going by the "actual length", not the theoretical length of the motorcycle. Hence, it would be appropriate if the table is created on the basis of actual distance. I can also see in the edit history that all Air India flights have been removed. I will of course be writing to Honorable Civil Aviation Minister, Government of India to apply for a Guinness World Record for AI 173 as the longest flight in the world. 202.142.121.173 ( talk) 17:34, 7 November 2016 (UTC)
Hello Mr Andrew, first of all it's not a marketing "puff piece". Please be objective and unbiased in your comments. The Air India flight is covering the longest actual distance currently. As I said, please provide reliable sources for your statement that only orthodromic distance matters in a flight and actual distance is meaningless. Strictly going by your statement, we should also apply the orthodromic distance logic to Solar Impulse. Don't you think we should edit that page and enter the orthodromic distance everywhere? The flight path is not varying by a significant margin everyday for AI 173, you can track the path online using flightradar24. We cannot be accounting for world records based on theoretical measures, so we should be treating both AI 173 and Solar Impulse by the same yardstick. I'm very neutral when it comes to disputes. If we have to apply the yardstick of orthodromic distance for flight length, then let us either be guided by a world body or apply the same yardstick everywhere. I can't imagine how much unnecessary editing would have been done on AI 173 already. So let us agree on a clear guideline on what defines flight length - orthodromic distance or actual flight length, purely based on available written knowledge, and not the personal opinions of certain users. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 202.142.121.145 ( talk) 19:13, 7 November 2016 (UTC)
Air India’s Delhi to San Francisco service is not the “world’s longest non-stop route” – just the longest way of getting somewhere: Last September Air India changed the flight from an Atlantic/Polar direction to a less-direct routing over the Pacific for operational reasons.
"Qatar Airways wins anna.aero's "Platinum Planet Prize" for launching the world's longest route: Doha-Auckland". Airline Network News and Analysis. 6 Feb 2017. Marc Lacoste ( talk) 14:34, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
@ Marc Lacoste: If SA204 is operated only with 346 not 343 then why the table Non-stop flight#Currently scheduled (top 30, by distance) list 343 for the flight? (I recall reading something about it being seasonal but I don't have any sourceon my hand now) C933103 ( talk) 09:45, 24 November 2016 (UTC)
There is a unreliable&incomprehensive source that seems to indicate the route were the longest route flown by A332, DC8, and such. Is there any further source for this? C933103 ( talk) 17:32, 26 November 2016 (UTC)
Was the flight done by 738 non-stop and were it scheduled? C933103 ( talk) 13:17, 4 December 2016 (UTC)